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Hellblazer #300


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Poll: Hellblazer #300 (23 member(s) have cast votes)

Your marks out of 10 for Hellblazer #300, please...

  1. 10 (0 votes [0.00%])

    Percentage of vote: 0.00%

  2. 9 (1 votes [4.35%])

    Percentage of vote: 4.35%

  3. 8 (1 votes [4.35%])

    Percentage of vote: 4.35%

  4. 7 (0 votes [0.00%])

    Percentage of vote: 0.00%

  5. 6 (0 votes [0.00%])

    Percentage of vote: 0.00%

  6. 5 (4 votes [17.39%])

    Percentage of vote: 17.39%

  7. 4 (4 votes [17.39%])

    Percentage of vote: 17.39%

  8. 3 (2 votes [8.70%])

    Percentage of vote: 8.70%

  9. 2 (3 votes [13.04%])

    Percentage of vote: 13.04%

  10. 1 (5 votes [21.74%])

    Percentage of vote: 21.74%

  11. Zero (3 votes [13.04%])

    Percentage of vote: 13.04%

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#21 J. White

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Posted 20 February 2013 - 06:56 PM

I came out of my "Hellblazer retirement" for this one. I had to see how it all ended. Given all the responces to the issues over the years I didn't really find it nessisary to track down old issues. That said, I find both convienent and disconcerning that this ending, lacking any real substance and clarity, could be read all on its own. I got what Mark speculated. If that's indeed a plausible interpretation, then I find it fitting; dodgy execution but still fitting to me.*

So that's it for me. I won't be bothered with "Constantine". The John Constantine I know is gone. So long.

*but I'm a pessimist and this is how I really feel.

View Postwolvy, on 20 February 2013 - 06:23 PM, said:

I consider this ending the typical ending of a series that ends on a cliff hanger. Nothing really get's resolved and more questions get asked. Leaving the viewer/reader frustrated and rather pissed off, with a mixture of depression.


#22 A. Heathen

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Posted 20 February 2013 - 07:58 PM

Oh dearie dearie me.

To address non-spoilery matters first, Camuncoli's artwork was always unsuited to this book for me, except in a one off sense in certain circumstances. It deteriorated from sub-Teddy Kristiansen sharp stylised work of the early days and then improved immensely when Landini started inking. Since Milligan arrived it's been worsening rather like a beautiful fresh apple rotting over a period of weeks as depicted by Bill Sienkewicz when drunk.

The writing deteriorated much more quickly.

The debasement of Gemma has an almost honourable denouement here, but helpfully she's still portrayed as an idiot - independently of any character development.

That final panel spoilered by Mr McMahon above should be viewed free of any context as it is the only panel worth reading in this entire comic.

Once we've all read it, it'd make a good forum banner with an iota of tweaking.

On to spoilers

Spoiler


Spoiler

[ Spoiler : The finale of last issue was almost plausible, but it was very quicly evident that this was not JC. Who could possibly have guessed Julian? I guess Demon Constantine.

I am only slightly pleased to see that the Anti-Kit known to me as Phanny* is as much of an idiot as Gemma. Can anyone tell me if Peter Milligan has written any decent women ever?
Or since the end of the original Shade if you prefer.

(*For that is what Epiphany Greaves is defined by in this issue.)

The lack of foreboding or even what James Wilkinson would have called foreshadowing (when there was any of that in this book) of several key factors of this issue is striking.

Is one of the "Fates" Ray Fawkes?
I think so.

Chas? Bizarre. It's like the writer has never read Hellblazer but has a 100 word character synopsis from the vertigo handbook.

That smoking ashes thing would have been a decent idea in the midst of a better story with some sort of emotional impact.

The First of the Fallen.
Need we say more than this story has the shittest superhero world villain ?

The Holy Shotgun of Angela fires Constantinian Kryptonite.
It sent Demon Constantine away because of some sort of magic didn't it? So, um.
Yeah, Demon Blood !
Maybe?

The it was all a dream option gives a sort of closure.
In my version, which will be the only one I need, this was a fictional life as per the Mike Carey Constantine Triplets.

I think the drinkers in the final panel are the various Hellblazer editors. Or some of them.
]
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"But that's the whole point, it's supernatural, these things happen.
It's not supposed to be realistic in that sense."

#23 Christian

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Posted 20 February 2013 - 11:08 PM

View Postwolvy, on 20 February 2013 - 06:23 PM, said:

I consider this ending the typical ending of a series that ends on a cliff hanger. Nothing really get's resolved and more questions get asked. Leaving the viewer/reader frustrated and rather pissed off, with a mixture of depression.

We'll have to wait for the movie. Where they'll ignore all the plot points left by the final issue, and pretend like things are at a totally different point from the last time we saw John, and just move ahead. See:X-Files second movie.

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

While there's nothing absolutely wrong with the plot, it's not a story I'm particularly interested in seeing in Hellblazer, especially considering that Ennis basically did the same plot better in one issue back in the 1990s.
John being married. John dealing with gangsters. It could be done ok, I suppose, but the plot just seems so generic to me. Like any character could easily fit into the plot.
What makes it special is the writing....The dialogue and the way the story is written, that makes the book stand out. Sure, it stands out as one of the worst comics being published by a major publisher today (DC also ranks quite a few of those, to be sure), but special none the less.

Anyway, it's good to know that long-time readers are being left lost by the final issue of Hellblazer. A fitting end to this book after the last 50 issues, and presaging the debut of CONSTANTINE!
This should be looked at in the next decade as a "how-to" guide for killing any interest in a character. Along with a detailed look at most Peter Parker stories since 1993.
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#24 Christian

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Posted 21 February 2013 - 12:47 AM

I liked how Milligan spells out all the "difficult" plot points for the slow readers, like that John was putting on an act to fool the Fates that he had accepted death, yet in the ending scene, things were left confusing even for the sharp readers. That about sums up my thoughts on the issue.
I'll give it a 2.

I wish I could say the final issue of the comic that was once my absolute favourite was hard to rate, but it wasn't. It felt like a bunch of random, tacked together scenes with bad writing, until the very end. The last couple of pages keep it from failing, but even that should have been done so much better.
You can say Milligan had to rush it, but it's not like the rest of his run holds together. It still could have been better written, evne if Milligan did have to rush to wrap up some dangling threads. Like we really even cared about The First story-line by this point, when the book is dead, and we'd rather forget Milligan's run anyway.

I guess I like the idea of John Constantine turning into Bacchus. That's what happens at the end, right? Right?
Vertigo 2013!
Sadly, I can only say it's finally over.

You know what I could have bought? John getting antsy with his new life. Not feeling as happy as he thought he would. Creating an elaborate, complicated scheme to convince everyone that he was dead, so he could leave Epiphany behind and restart his life again.
It's got the bastard John, but who tries to do right. Feeling that it's better if Epiphany feels he's dead and moves on, rather than taking the guts to actually end it himself.
A bittersweet ending.
Makes more sense than the mess that was all of issue #300, minus the last few pages.
"I wish it were fin du globe," said Dorian with a sigh.
"Life is such a great disappointment."
-Oscar Wilde

#25 Christian

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Posted 21 February 2013 - 12:54 AM

I mean, Bacchus is a really good comic. It's only fitting that in the end, tired, worn out Hellblazer turns into a character in a better written book.
Too bad Bacchus has been gone off the racks for over a decade now....If this had gotten more people reading Bacchus, it would have been worth all the Milligan run....even the turning Gemma into an incest obsessed object of sexism.
Maybe, what we can take away from all this, is that Bacchus was an object lesson. Hellblazer probably should have ended over a decade ago, then we'd be talking about what a damn grand comic that was, and how much we missed it.
Instead of pondering if Constantine could actually be worse (as opposed to just as bad as) than the final couple of years of Hellblazer.
Huh. Bacchus, indeed. A lot to think about, kiddies.
"I wish it were fin du globe," said Dorian with a sigh.
"Life is such a great disappointment."
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#26 Lou K

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Posted 21 February 2013 - 01:32 AM

That was one of the worst comic books I've ever read. Last time I read something that bad was the last time I tried to read Hellblazer. If you're going to trot out garbage like this, go ahead and shut it down.
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#27 Christian

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Posted 21 February 2013 - 01:47 AM

And, the positive reviews are already coming:
http://www.themoonis...blazer-300.html
Of course.
Somehow, I don't think the scenes with Gemma were exactly Hellblazer going out with dignity....

The review seems to spend a lot of time discussing John being dead, although that meant little in the scheme of the story we just read.
For some reason, the reviewer thinks that people would be better off without John, as shown by the pages of issue #300.
Somehow, that did not make it into the plot, as far as I saw.
It might have been a decent direction to pursue.B
But, what did we see? Finn sitting on a grave, getting drunk, wanting to be John. Gemma being a sexist caricature, per Milligan's usual. Epiphany saying she didn't want to be without John (like it was Days of Our Lives). Chas getting punched in the nose. Where was the "things are better without John"?
Terry Greaves was probably the only one who could say that, and he was supposed to be an antagonist.
You could argue John messed their lives up (at a stretch with Epiphany, at the least), but his being dead didn't make anything better for anyone. In fact, it was John's freakin' ghost that was going around, trying to sort out the other character's lives, to a large extent.
I'm just not sure where the review got the idea that dead John was shown as a positive in any character's life, during the brief period he was dead.
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#28 Demon Chas08

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Posted 21 February 2013 - 03:22 AM

View PostChristian, on 21 February 2013 - 01:47 AM, said:

And, the positive reviews are already coming:
http://www.themoonis...blazer-300.html
Of course.
Somehow, I don't think the scenes with Gemma were exactly Hellblazer going out with dignity....

The review seems to spend a lot of time discussing John being dead, although that meant little in the scheme of the story we just read.
For some reason, the reviewer thinks that people would be better off without John, as shown by the pages of issue #300.
Somehow, that did not make it into the plot, as far as I saw.
It might have been a decent direction to pursue.B
But, what did we see? Finn sitting on a grave, getting drunk, wanting to be John. Gemma being a sexist caricature, per Milligan's usual. Epiphany saying she didn't want to be without John (like it was Days of Our Lives). Chas getting punched in the nose. Where was the "things are better without John"?
Terry Greaves was probably the only one who could say that, and he was supposed to be an antagonist.
You could argue John messed their lives up (at a stretch with Epiphany, at the least), but his being dead didn't make anything better for anyone. In fact, it was John's freakin' ghost that was going around, trying to sort out the other character's lives, to a large extent.
I'm just not sure where the review got the idea that dead John was shown as a positive in any character's life, during the brief period he was dead.

Most review sites are paid off anyway. Both that and (as we've all established) are fucktards.

As for the art, I, like Mark noticed the odd pattern with recent artists during the past ten years. It's wierd that the three's art declined compared to Phillips and Dillion who improved over the years (and Will Simpson's seeing as he's now HBO bound these days storyboarding Games of Thrones). Frusin was Risso-lite when he first started with Azzarello then by midway through Carey, he cuts loose with the spaghetti legs and arms plus John's Eastwood face. Manco's a oddity seeing as his inking style (plus the slight tweaking of John's shoes and coat collar going up and down throughout Mina's stint) changed between the start of #216-232 and onwards. Then by the Laughing Magician arc he goes all out sketch wise til the very end. And Camuncoli?

Eleven years ago, his art (with Cam Stewart) was a breath of fresh air. Surprised he was on the guest route like Phillips and Dillon was during there respective eras  Once the Chas centered #206 rolled in, his style was tweaked when he was first paired with Stefano Landini and looking back on that #168-9 and since.
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#29 A. Heathen

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Posted 21 February 2013 - 06:15 AM

View PostChristian, on 21 February 2013 - 12:47 AM, said:

I guess I like the idea of John Constantine turning into Bacchus. That's what happens at the end, right? Right?
Vertigo 2013!
Sadly, I can only say it's finally over.

:hattip:
* * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *
"But that's the whole point, it's supernatural, these things happen.
It's not supposed to be realistic in that sense."

#30 A. Heathen

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Posted 21 February 2013 - 06:30 AM

Good thoughts on the review, Christian, perhaps the reviews will be like the final Azzarello arc, many varied accounts of what did not happen.

Here's an additional comment.
None of the loose ends really pre-date Milligan's run on the book.

Actually, Gemma's supposed reasons for reverting to a gangster's moll are supposedly triggered by bereavement, I suppose.
It seems probable that the decision to cancel Hellblazer was made only shortly before it was announced in November, which may well have left them with half a year's worth of plotlines to resolve. But as a double sized issue there's a load of chaff here.
An ensemble issue with various artists telling us how everyone is better off without John would have been much more moving rather than All The Constantines Fuck Epiphany Greaves.

I really hope that Peter Milligan rediscovers the storytelling ability he still had when he wrote Scab.

DC Editorial can stick their Children's Constantine up their collective arse.
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"But that's the whole point, it's supernatural, these things happen.
It's not supposed to be realistic in that sense."

#31 slinker

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Posted 21 February 2013 - 06:43 AM

After  having read the pages in between those posted here, I will say it made more sense. But not much, the whole thing about John wanting Epiphany to screw his nephew is dumb as hell just to throw off the Fates. Hellblazer is over, DC sucks many nasty cocks life goes on, and I'm done with Hellblazer, since it's done. I'm not going to read Constantine, I don't much care for their John. He's nothing compared to ours. Lemire and Fawkes really oughta get a fucking clue about who their PG-13 character is, cuz he sure ain't John COnstantine, not even close, not the way they write him. Justice League Dark is NOT something to be proud of, so fuck off. I need to do something else. I'm done being workedup over this.
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#32 Christian

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Posted 21 February 2013 - 07:13 AM

PG 13 John? Umm...no. More like PG John. He's all bright and shiny now, and says things like "shoot" and "heck".
"I wish it were fin du globe," said Dorian with a sigh.
"Life is such a great disappointment."
-Oscar Wilde

#33 A. Heathen

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Posted 21 February 2013 - 07:35 AM

In summary ...Attached File  TWB2013.jpg   20.37K   13 downloads
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"But that's the whole point, it's supernatural, these things happen.
It's not supposed to be realistic in that sense."

#34 JohnMcMahon

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Posted 21 February 2013 - 08:54 AM

View PostLou K, on 21 February 2013 - 01:32 AM, said:

Last time I read something that bad was the last time I tried to read Hellblazer.

I'm probably going to be chuckling over this for the rest of the day :hattip:
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#35 JasonT

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Posted 21 February 2013 - 08:58 AM

View PostChristian, on 20 February 2013 - 11:08 PM, said:

This should be looked at in the next decade as a "how-to" guide for killing any interest in a character.


#36 JohnMcMahon

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Posted 21 February 2013 - 09:33 AM

View PostChristian, on 21 February 2013 - 01:47 AM, said:

And, the positive reviews are already coming:

I was going to include a bonus poll asking people how many stars they think CBR will give it, I'm going with four myself.
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#37 Kei

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Posted 21 February 2013 - 10:12 AM

Meh. Nobody can explain what the fuck hapened at the end? I'm really clueless here.  And to clear another point, did I miss any issue, sidestory or whatever in which it would be explained why gemma goes from a tough young woman who wants to be in her uncles footsteps and is actually likeable to the trainwreck we meet at Johns wedding. I didnt get that at all and its entirely possible that I missed an issue here or something I dont know.

I thought there were meant to be nods to important hellblazer characters and I was baffled that Kit wasnt even mentioned (for me one of the more important characters) also, yay more screentime for finn than for Chas. What was this, what did I miss here?

Sorry for the questions I only picked up the series 2 Years ago and then started reading from the beginning so I might missed something, all in all this issue made me a little sad.

#38 JohnMcMahon

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Posted 21 February 2013 - 10:44 AM

Chas really should've stomp-fucked Finn, the sentiment behind that scene was nice but it did feel off that he was the one who ended up laid out.

Being raped by her Uncle's demonic counterpart may explain Gemma's character change!
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#39 Kei

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Posted 21 February 2013 - 11:27 AM

wasnt she a wreck before that?

#40 Master Pernath

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Posted 21 February 2013 - 11:48 AM

Yes, Gemma was already a mess before John's wedding. You could say that her mother's death really affected her, but when she appeared in Mina's final issues, she was fine.

By the way, we can all pretend that Hellblazer ended with Carey's run. What a good title it was!




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