409 replies to this topic

[A. Heathen]

"Graphic novels (book length comics)"  

[Avaunt]

http://www.tor.com/b...re-reread-spawn

[Lou K]

Alan Moore's work on Spawn was dreadful. As was Gaiman's and Frank Miller's. I've often wondered if these guys had good ideas or stories and were essentialy 'cockblocked', for lack of a better term, by Todd McFarlane.

[A. Heathen]

Polyhedral pegs into a square hole.

I thought they were enjoyable enough at the time. They are the only issues I still own.

[Christian]

It might just be the concept.

I thought Moore had the strongest issue of the Spawn monthly title (#8).
The rest of Moore's work in the Spawniverse was pretty dreadful.
Even Gaiman's work on Spawn titles was bad.
The Paul Jenkins Spawn:The Undead series was probably the best Spawn stories in history though.

Also, that link has a mistake, as Moore did eventually write a Shadowhawk story.
I own some Shadowhawk comic, and the only reason that would be the case is if it contained a Moore story.

EDIT:Yeah, it was an one-shot special.
http://scans-daily.d...thread=50233892
I remember liking the Moore story.

[Spain]

Lou K, on 05 June 2012 - 03:22 PM, said:

Alan Moore's work on Spawn was dreadful. As was Gaiman's and Frank Miller's. I've often wondered if these guys had good ideas or stories and were essentialy 'cockblocked', for lack of a better term, by Todd McFarlane.

Gaiman did create Angela, I believe. She almost makes me get close to a gorgeous girl in my high school (no problem boys, I was informed that my white socks were keeping girls away).
I think Spawn is too manicheist to put easily a lot of ambiguous morale and depth on it.

[slinker]

Is Moore the most famous comics writer after Lee. Or is he even more godly than Lee? Stan Lee, as much as I dig him, is pretty much a corporate "yessir, nossir" kind of guy, it seems. Moore seems to wretch at the very mention of anything corporate or mainstream, which I of course approve, though it means dicksnot to him or anyone else.

[Avaunt]

*Throws out ten pairs of white socks*

:)

[Christian]

I'd have to say it's a toss-up between Lee and Gaiman. Moore is in third place.
If you stop the random person in the street and ask them if they know any comic creators, they'll either name Stan Lee or Neil Gaiman. I'm not sure which is the bigger name anymore, as Gaiman has gone to become a name on the New York Times' best seller list, which gives him the added recognition outside of comic books.
Moore's name has been on the rise due to Hollywood movies, but he hasn't reached the plateu of Lee or Gaiman yet.

And, yes, Lee has always been the corporate stooge, but he was well rewarded by being granted access to the Dr. Doom time machine and deleting knowledge of the role Kirby and Ditko had in the creation of all those well-loved Marvel comic icons.

[Avaunt]

If someone ever stopped me, I would stroke my beard and say " Umm . . ., that bloke who did the thing about the nazi mice?", just so I could think happily about all the nerds grinding their teeth.

[Lou K]

Christian, on 05 June 2012 - 09:47 PM, said:

The Paul Jenkins Spawn:The Undead series was probably the best Spawn stories in history though.

Very much this. Spawn: The Undead was great.

Als, I don't think Neil Gaiman is anywhere near on the same level of recognition as Stan the Man.

[slinker]

Avaunt, on 06 June 2012 - 04:28 AM, said:

If someone ever stopped me, I would stroke my beard and say " Umm . . ., that bloke who did the thing about the nazi mice?", just so I could think happily about all the nerds grinding their teeth.

that was the first comic i read as an adult. i daresay it got me back into comics, or went a considerable way in doing so. i had no idea gaiman was so big.

[Christian]

I don't think he really is...he's probably not terribly much more than my size, really, and I'm considered very small for a male.
He's more average, himself, I'd have to say.
It's just his presence that makes him come across that way.

[dogpoet]

slinker, on 06 June 2012 - 01:15 AM, said:

Moore seems to wretch at the very mention of anything corporate or mainstream, which I of course approve, though it means dicksnot to him or anyone else.

Oh, so he didn't do a lot of work for Marvel, IPC and DC before he settled down to spend the next thirty years whining about them ad nauseam, then? I don't think Image were exactly what you'd call a collectivist commune when he was doing stuff for them, either.
(This cheap joke avoids the basic point here, which is that anybody involved in publishing comics in this day and age at any level beyond self publishing their own work is involved in a corporate activity, and that anything which can be found in a shopping mall is part of the cultural mainstream. Anybody who claims otherwise in this day and age is either lying, deluded or so full of shit that they probably squelch when they walk.)

[Christian]

Creator-ownership of work does make quite a big difference.
I'd like to see a worker at General Motors be able to retain ownership of anything they create and be able to shop it around to different distributors if they become disgruntled with the terms of their GM contract.

The point of comic book Graphic Novels or Trade Paper Backs being sold at the Barnes & Nobles corporate chain (as opposed to solely within self-owned comic book small businesses), on the other hand, is a different issue.

[Cunning Man]

I would just like to say I'm not overly pleased with the use of parentheses in this thread's comments.  I'm not especially happy about them, at all.

[dogpoet]

I like parentheses, and enjoy using them.

(And I'm about to start reading through Promethea as the first two collections arrived this morning...)

[Avaunt]

That is a comic I love ( I love that comic ) all you need is Love ( love, love ).

Punktuation, I also like.

[slinker]

dogpoet, on 07 June 2012 - 09:01 PM, said:

slinker, on 06 June 2012 - 01:15 AM, said:

Moore seems to wretch at the very mention of anything corporate or mainstream, which I of course approve, though it means dicksnot to him or anyone else.

Oh, so he didn't do a lot of work for Marvel, IPC and DC before he settled down to spend the next thirty years whining about them ad nauseam, then? I don't think Image were exactly what you'd call a collectivist commune when he was doing stuff for them, either.
(This cheap joke avoids the basic point here, which is that anybody involved in publishing comics in this day and age at any level beyond self publishing their own work is involved in a corporate activity, and that anything which can be found in a shopping mall is part of the cultural mainstream. Anybody who claims otherwise in this day and age is either lying, deluded or so full of shit that they probably squelch when they walk.)

I just meant the image he cultivates. truth be told I don't have much of an opinion on him. The last few things by him I read sucked ass (Necropolis--was that the title? Or was that Delano? I'm thinking of the Cthulhu story where the lizard rapes the detective). But he did write V, and Watchmen, two of my faves, so. Morrison would be choice for #1. He has his own con now just devoted to him. Gaiman, Lee, or Moore have one of those?

[A. Heathen]

Do you mean Stan Lee? His convention is the world.
Every time a new nerd culture hit comes on the scene, there is Stan The Man cameoing all over your face.

There is a small corner of every mainstream comics convention where embittered Alanites rail about how cover versions of literary and fictional characters is a noble cause, and totally not like reusing and rehashing a trademark character to make money like how comics publishers keep doing and what they have been doing for years and it is about time they stopped. This conversation is usually held in the queue to get Dave Gibbons or David Lloyd to sign Watchmen #1 or V for Vendetta #1 or waiting for the "Women in Comics" panel. One of the Mooreian acolytes holds aloft a first edition paperback novelisation of "Tim Burton's Alice In Wonderland" signed by Melinda Gebbie. Two, or possibly three of those listening drool at the sight of this. And when I say drool I am not necessarily referring to an oral expression. The four-color permeated perspiration of pre-midlife pubescents oozes from the walls as condensation carries it from corpulent carrier bag clenching chaps (and occasional chapettes). A tannoy announces that Caroline Munro is signing photographs in the Hall of Fame and the "Women in Comics" room empties slightly.

Gaiman owns every single perky goth in the Western World. And he has a hot chick rock star for a bird.
He doesn't need a con.