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Christian

Marvel's One World Order

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dogpoet    443

It's got to be better than DeMatteis, I suppose.

:tongue:

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On 10/7/2017 at 2:15 PM, Christian said:

Not a bad idea, since no one has topped the Moench 1980s run. Some of the more recent Moon Knight books haven't been bad though....Warren Ellis, Brian Wood, and Jeff Lemire writing the book. The Lemire run I would really recommend, especially if you're a fan of the Moench issues.

Moon Knight's up there as one of my favorite Marvel characters, but the 1990s were not kind to him while Dixon and later Terry Kavanaugh was writing his book.  Moench was indeed the best, especially with that sweet sweet Sienkiewicz artwork.  I will agree, though, that title run of Ellis, Wood, and Lemire has all been fantastic.  I even liked Cullen Bunn's short run, though it didn't hold up with the stuff surrounding it.  Here's hoping Max Bemis is able to keep the title's momentum going some.

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dogpoet    443

The really wonderful thing about Sienkiwicz's art in the original Moon Knight is that you can see him experimenting with his style as the series progresses. It might not be as blatant as his experimentation in New Mutants at the same sort of time, but he still moves from a very smooth Neal Adams imitation to something a lot more unusual and distinctive in both.

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I can't remember the issue number (# 26 maybe?), but the story "Hit It" was where Sienkiewicz REALLY took off on Moon Knight.  The Neal Adams impressions had already started to fade into the background (whereas in the beginning of the series where he was deliberately swiping Adams Batman poses for MK) and his art style was evolving rapidly.  His progression as an artist on those early 80s Marvel books like Moon Knight and New Mutants was fascinating to watch; funny, though.  I was a kid when those books were coming out, and I loved his work on Moon Knight.  When he came over to New Mutants, though, I HATED the art; now, I can see just how great his experimentation was, but Kid Chris definitely did not like square headed Cannonball, lol.

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dogpoet    443

The squareheaded Cannonball beats anything the next name artist on New mutants ever did, and has done to date. :wink2: 

Has Dave McKean ever cited Sienkewicz as an influence?

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Christian    735

Yeah, Liefield's art is probably more kid friendly, since it looks like something an untalented child would draw.

I didn't start buying New Mutants until after Claremont had left the book. I had decided that I would stick solely to Uncanny X-Men and not worry about New Mutants for a number of years. So, I missed the classic era when it was first being released. I dropped the book right when Liefield was taking over the book. It wasn't actually because of Liefield though, as I was just at that point where I thought that "comics were for kids". Regrettably, that meant I missed the debut of Deadpool, so I didn't have a copy to sell for big bucks after people decided that the character was a big deal, for whatever reason.

Anyway, the point being I didn't get to read the Sienkewicz issues until I was already an adult. I'm not sure what I would have thought of the art if I had read the issues in the 1980s. As it was, I was totally smitten by the Sienkewicz artwork.

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dogpoet    443

It's actually weird how Sienkiwicz gets overlooked as an exponent of the whole "look how adult and pretentious comics are getting these days" thing of the late '80s. If it wasn't for brits raising the bar remarkably high, Stray Toasters and Elektra would be the two best Epic comics by a mile, rather than Marshall Law and The Last American...

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Christian    735

I would rank Elektra: Assassin as the best book Epic published, but otherwise, yeah, I'd agree that those are Epic's four best titles.

Jim Starlin's Dreadstar ranks pretty highly, as well. So, a top five, maybe, instead of a top four. Well, McKeever's Metropol is definitely worth reading too. So, top six.

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49 minutes ago, Christian said:

I would rank Elektra: Assassin as the best book Epic published, but otherwise, yeah, I'd agree that those are Epic's four best titles.

Jim Starlin's Dreadstar ranks pretty highly, as well. So, a top five, maybe, instead of a top four. Well, McKeever's Metropol is definitely worth reading too. So, top six.

I'd add Moonshadow by DeMatteis and Muth near the top of that list as well.

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Christian    735

There were quite a few good Epic Comics. I just want to look back at all these great comics coming out of Epic from the 1980s!

Metropol was definitely Epic Comics, Dog. I thought it was a 1980s comic, as it looks and feels very much 1980s, but it was actually published by Epic in 1991. So, it was one of the later Epic Comic releases.

Ixnay-I wasn't as impressed by Moonshadow as a lot of people, although I know it's accepted as a classic now. I don't know why it didn't work for me all that well, considering DeMatteis is one of my favourite comic writers, and he's usually so great working together with Muth. I just never loved it as much as so many other DeMatteis books.

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I've not read Moonshadow in over a decade, but I remember it being really touching when I first read it.  That was when Vertigo was re-releasing it in the 1990s, I was too young for most Epic stuff in the 80s.  That said, though, didn't DeMatteis originally publish Blood: A Tale through Epic as well?  Or was that one a later Vertigo thing like Seekers: Into the Mystery?

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Christian    735

No, it was originally released by Epic and then later reprinted by Vertigo. I have to admit, Blood was my least favourite DeMatteis story. I can't think of any other DeMatteis comics that I can say I did not like (I did like Moonshadow, it just didn't effect me the way that so many other DeMatteis comics has, and I expected more when I read it), but I did not like Blood. They both have very lovely artwork though.

Maybe I just have a problem with J.M. DeMatteis comics being published by Epic Comics? I'm pretty sure that those were the only two Epic Comics from DeMatteis.

Greenberg the Vampire was published as a Marvel Graphic Novel, and not through Epic, I'm pretty sure.

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Yeah, you're right about Greenberg being published as a graphic novel, not through Epic.  Out of the three original works that DeMatteis did for Marvel, I think Greenberg was my least favorite, though I admit that I barely remember Blood at all.  One day I need to revisit all three.

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dogpoet    443

Blood isn't all that good, to be honest. I'm heartened to find that Christian agrees with me on that one, as he likes DeMatteis' approach a lot more than I do.

(Though it is very funny on the level that you've got a very wordy comic indeed only being worth reading for the magnificent job Kent Williams did on polishing the turd of a script...)

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Christian    735

Greenberg wasn't one of my favourite DeMatteis comics either. It was fun enough though. It was sort of like the Vampire's Kiss movie (which is simply marvelous!), only with a sympathetic lead character and featuring a real vampire.

As far as creator owned work from DeMatteis, it's his work at Vertigo that I really love.

DeMatteis did a lot of excellent work for Marvel, I just wasn't all that impressed with any of his creator owned projects for them.

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Other than Seekers, what other Vertigo work did DeMatteis have?  Moonshadow and Blood were republishing of his Epic work and his Doctor Fate series was pre-Vertigo, so what am I forgetting? 

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dogpoet    443

I think there was a miniseries, or possibly a one shot, called Mercy and a sequel to Moonshadow done as a big expensive hardback as well.

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Christian    735

Yep, I think those three were all DeMatteis did for Vertigo....but they were all excellent. Seekers into the Mystery was one of my favourite comics, and the one-shot Mercy and the mini-series the Last One. Those were all really great comics.

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dogpoet    443

What about Even More Moonshadow? Was that Vertigo or dd he do that one through Image or somebody?

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Christian    735

Oh yeah....what was that? Oh, Farewell Moonshadow.

I own the big Vertigo Moonshadow collection, and it just included that one-shot in with the rest of the Moonshadow story, so I forgot that he published that separately at Vertigo.

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dogpoet    443

It was published separately for an arm and half a leg in hardcover, iirc.

:wink2:

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Lou K    1,054
1 hour ago, Christian said:

Yep, I think those three were all DeMatteis did for Vertigo....but they were all excellent. Seekers into the Mystery was one of my favourite comics, and the one-shot Mercy and the mini-series the Last One. Those were all really great comics.

It's too bad you missed him at MCCC. I basically poured my heart out to him telling him what Seekers meant to me. He was quite appreciative. Nice fellow.

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Christian    735

I know. I regret not getting to meet him. He was certainly one of the top comic book creators who I wanted to meet in person, at some point. I probably missed my chance.

So far, John Ostrander is the only comic book writer I've been able to meet who I would consider to be someone on that mythical list.

DeMatteis does have a blog, and I did contact him on the internet to let him know what his writing has meant to me, and the effect it has had on shaping my own views of life.

After Steve Gerber died, I realized that I only contacted him shortly before his death to tell him how much his work had touched me, and that if I had waited much longer to tell Gerber, he would have been dead. So, I wanted to make sure that I let DeMatteis know too. Yeah, he seems like a very nice person, in his reply to me.

I'm sure it's a major pivotal moment in the life of Steve Gerber that he got to hear how much Man Thing and Howard the Duck helped me get through a really hard time in my life....and he did relate to me with his own personal issues.....but, I mean, it's good to let someone know that their writing wasn't taken for granted.

I've had an E-mail exchange with Jamie Delano in the past, so I let him know my love for his writing as well.

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