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Garth Ennis' masterwork...

What is it?  

25 members have voted

  1. 1. What is it?

    • Hitman
      10
    • Preacher
      15


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Wasn't the Kit solo story in H.B. also called "Heartland" though?

 

There was a one-shot Kit special called "Heartland", which is an amazing little story. Ennis at his best.

I think Heartland is the single best issue of any comic that he's written.

Many may think that Ennis is at his best when writing violent, gore-ridden stories, but no. Ennis is truly at his best writing quiet stories about sad, drunk Irish people.

I think he's very good when he writes about sad, drunk Irish people, and he's very good when he writes about a particular, sometimes sad, drunk Englishman. But he's best when he writes about Northern Ireland, and I'd like to see him do more of that.

Have you read Troubled Souls?

No. Is that something Ennis wrote?

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Is that something Ennis wrote?

The first comic strip he ever published (in Crisis in 1990): Dicks was a spin off from it using a couple of minor characters, but this one was far more worthy and a lot duller. I think it's been collected a few times, but not recently.

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I got Hitman: Ace of Killers from the library but I haven't read any of the previous threads yet. Should I read it? Or should I put it off and read them in order?

 

 

It works well enough on its own, as far as I remember.

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I don't know if he's written him before or how much, but Ennis on a Guy Gardner (As Green Lantern) solo would rock.

I think he could honestly make Gardner work, and cool (Was he ever?)

 

Lots of flying green dildos too.

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TESTOSTEROHNE:

I think he could honestly make Gardner work, and cool

 

Good thinkin'!

 

 

(Was he ever?)

 

Gardner worked as a buffoon in the Giffen/DeMatteis Justice League America, but the character was ill-conceived as a Green Lantern. And "Warrior" blew. The character should've been killed off years ago as a "major" (a la Mike Carey) death in some crossover or something.

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Yes, DeMatteis and Giffen were masters of seeing through all the pretentiousness of DCU characters and showing us how they really reflect when everyone isn't so uptight about making superheroes serious.

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Gay Gardner.

It's just so obvious.

You've got all the emerald toilet humour and Kiss My Ring jokes than you ever wanted.

 

Issue 1-Guy bangs a lesbian. He wins a prize. Guy gets drunk.

 

Issue 2-Guy pulps a team of robotic homosexuals with flying green dildos. Guy gets drunk.

 

Issue 3-The New Arch Nemesis Uber Villian of the Arc, Cockface (from Sector Fuck You), makes his first appearance. He has a yellow Prince Albert!

 

Issue 4-Guy gets drunk again and hates God. Garth retconns Guy as a catholic.

 

Issue 5-Guy catches two of the Guardians, in bed with each other. Later he has to stop Prince Charles from killing the Pope. Guy gets drunk.

 

Issue 6-Guy gets drunk. He has an oddly sexual dream about Hal, but who was the Mary? Using his ring, Guy creates a team of Swedish ladyfriends.......

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:icon_rolleyes: Have you ever even read a Garth Ennis commick?

 

You missed the part where Gardner suddenly remembers he has Irish friends. And is Irish.

 

:)

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:icon_rolleyes: Have you ever even read a Garth Ennis commick?

 

You missed the part where Gardner suddenly remembers he has Irish friends. And is Irish.

 

:)

If you look at your DC Cosmos pre Crisis A-Z, you'll find that Sector Fuck You is actually a sub quadrant of sector 2284, and is infact Ireland.

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I got Hitman: Ace of Killers from the library but I haven't read any of the previous threads yet. Should I read it? Or should I put it off and read them in order?

 

 

It works well enough on its own, as far as I remember.

Thanks. I hadn't read it until now cuz I was afraid it'd spoil the others for me.

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I finally managed to read the entire run of Hitman last week, and fuck me if it isn't even better than I thought it was when I'd only read bits of it. I already thought it was better than Preacher, but I'd underestimated quite the extent to which that's true.

 

Best thing he's ever written by miles - everything that made Preacher great is there, but minus the bits which made it crap, and with a whole load of extra stuff added in (Dogwelder! Bueno! Zombie Penguins!) which couldn't have worked in even the Preacher universe. Rather like Preacher, the balance between dumb comedy and gut-punching emotional impact is brilliantly-handled all the way through - there were at least three or four character deaths which totally knocked me out.

 

There's barely a weak arc in the whole series, and it's a fucking crime that it's not all available in trade. Bastards.

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The dinosaur one was a bit lame, I thought, but I suppose Ennis needed to lighten it up a bit by that point.

 

Amazing stuff, though, and I can only hope that The Boys will be half as good.

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I actually really enjoyed the dinosaurs one, but I suspect that had a lot to do with the fact that, like Tommy, I was a fanatical dino obsessive as a kid. I also liked the nods to Pat Mills' Flesh stories from 2000AD - the style of the text boxes was strikingly (and, I assume, deliberately) similar. It was still a bit silly, though, I suppose.

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I just read Hitman: Ace of Killers yesterday. It wasn't what I really expected. What's with all the silliness? I have to say it cheered me up as I was sort of down yesterday.

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A lot of Hitman is very silly indeed - it's Garth having fun in the DC Universe. Ironically, given how much of his work seems to rely on pushing the boundaries of good taste and 'extreme' content (violence, language, crudeness), he really thrived under the limitations of a DCU series - having to restrain himself slightly, and rely on implication rather than in-your-face obviousness (even the weakest "Bueno" gag is at least 15x funnier than anything involving the Sex Detectives in Preacher, for example) really brought out his strengths.

 

It still has some really heavy emotional content too, though - there's just not so much of it in 'Ace of Killers'.

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Agreed. I love Preacher enough to forgive its weaker storylines, but Hitman is awesome all the way through. I think it was paced perfectly, and the shift midway through from silly, enjoyable gunplay to darker, heavier stories was very effective. Ennis spent a good deal of time setting up likeable and memorable characters, giving them history and wacky adventures before proceeding to tear them down. "For Tomorrow" "The Old Dog" and "Closing Time" have had me choked up each time I've read them.

 

The only criticism I can think of levying at Hitman is the inclusion of stand-in words for "fuck." But that's pretty minor, and it might have been a good thing. Taking away Ennis' ability to spew profanity probably forced him to concentrate on other things.

 

Like, you know, writing.

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War in the Sun was followed by Salvation, a work of art and one of Ennis best works ever.

 

It's been said here he got weaker near the end, but he wrote the whole thing before he even began. Not the detailed script, but the general flow, he knew about how many issues it would be and what the trades would be broken up as. He didn;t 'run out of ideas' or any such thing.

 

I was pretty religious when I first bought Preacher, then I quit comics for a few years, and Preacher is what brought me back. I lost my faith in those few years and Preacher was a clear and excellent gauge of that progress. When I began the series I found it offensive but liked it in a naughty secret way. When I came back to comics, Preacher was my flagship title as it was no longer offensive and served as a bit of an icon of my new attitude.

 

The ending is not just a twist, it illustrates the Neitchzean God is Dead philosophy for our generation.

 

I love Hitman too, but it is just well written fun. Preacher is Ennis baby.

 

After he got the main story bubbling around his head, he came to America and travelled across the route that Jesse took. He drank in New York and ate peyote he got from some native friends in the desert and went to a graveyard in New Orleans. This was his important work. As much as I love Hitman, it just doesn't compare.

 

I try to read Salvation at least once a year.

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Ennis' take on the theme "God is dead" is the same as the Nihilist version of Trent Reznor, "God is dead, and no one cares, if there is a Hell, I'll see you there".

Neither are particularly enlightened or with anything new to say.

It's not a modern take on Nietzsche's "God is dead", because Nietzsche's idea is still the modern version.

I'd argue we've gotten beyond the talking point of Nietzsche's concerns of if life has purpose or if morals can sustain in a world where nationalism and science have replaced God.

 

Both Ennis and Reznor repeated Nietzsche's idea and didn't do anything new or clever with the idea, except perhaps misunderstand them.

Instead of taking on the mantle of the Father, they are still Sons, although now the petulant children analogous to the Generation X assumptions of a generation of child wholly influenced by the concept of divorce.

 

Although one could argue about Philip K Dick's views on God, I'd say Philip K. Dick wrote the definitive illustration of "God is dead" for our generation. There's a brief mention in a story that scientists have discovered God's dead body floating in space, and that was the importance of that scene to the entire story. Just that science had discovered God's dead body floating in space. It wasn't mentioned again nor did it figure into the story again. The ultimate illustration of "God is dead" for our generation.

It's just accepted fact, and science has proven it to us. We don't need God (although this last point probably wasn't Dick's intent).

 

The post-modern version of "God is dead" was implemented by the existentialists to sum up a world where there never was a God.

 

Certainly Ennis was coming to terms with his own childhood and the idea is still important in a world which is not post-Christianity, but yet at the same time, going back to Nietzsche's philosophy, I find to be a step backwards.

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It's been said here he got weaker near the end, but he wrote the whole thing before he even began. Not the detailed script, but the general flow, he knew about how many issues it would be and what the trades would be broken up as. He didn;t 'run out of ideas' or any such thing.

 

I don't care how long in advance he'd planned it - the last few trades' worth of Preacher are vastly less interesting, intelligent, and well-crafted than the first dozen or so issues. Whether he ran out of ideas, ran out of enthusiasm, or just didn't know when to stop, I don't care. The quality of the final work is what matters, and to my mind, and that of most people I know (and, so far as I can make out, the majority of critics', for what little that's worth), the quality of the latter issues of the series is distinctly lacking.

 

The ending is not just a twist, it illustrates the Neitchzean God is Dead philosophy for our generation.

 

The ending isn't a twist at all. It's fucking obvious where the whole thing is going from at least the second trade on. Nor is it big, clever, or original.

 

I love Hitman too, but it is just well written fun. Preacher is Ennis baby.

 

After he got the main story bubbling around his head, he came to America and travelled across the route that Jesse took. He drank in New York and ate peyote he got from some native friends in the desert and went to a graveyard in New Orleans. This was his important work. As much as I love Hitman, it just doesn't compare.

 

Well, just because Ennis took it seriously doesn't make it good by default, you know. Chris Claremont is popularly-rumoured to have a long-held, very active interest in the sexual practises underpinning the innumerable bondage-themed stories with which he peppers his X-Men comics - does the fact that the author is* transferring his real-world experiences into his writing automatically make, say, X-Treme X-Men a significant literary work of our times?

 

Besides, I'd take serious issue with the "Hitman's just well-written fun" claim, too - the end of '10,000 Bullets', to take just one of numerous examples, is easily as emotionally-resonant and powerful as anything in Preacher, while I'd say that Arseface, the Sex Detectives, Otis Whats'ispuss from Salvation, and various others are just as silly (and, for the most part, considerably less amusing) than even the most puerile Section Eight gag. There's a lot of serious stuff in Hitman, and a lot of infantile, puerile crap in Preacher - I'd have trouble arguing that either was significantly less 'serious' or 'important' than the other. Depends on whether you prefer cowboys or superheroes as a backdrop, I suppose.

 

 

*allegedly

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I did it without blowing a gasket over the suggestion that, out of the whole series, fucking Salvation just got singled out as great art, too.

 

...oops.

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Hitman was good because he didnt try to go over the top to much, and 9/10 times You ended up enjoying the characters.

 

Preacher was so-so.

 

The Boys.. I didnt really like the first issue, havent read the 2nd. But from what I saw, it didnt look like much besides ennis yelling out "I HATE CAPES!!!"

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it didnt look like much besides ennis yelling out "I HATE CAPES!!!"

And it isn't like Ennis is capable of yelling that even half as loud as Pat Mills did back in 1988...

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