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Batman Reloaded

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The last issue of Morrison's Batman was ninja man-bat-tastic, as expected. And the solicitation for next month made me do my little dance of complete geek-joy as I have now been totally right in both my guesses as to the sprog-names in first Catwoman and now Batman. I wish I could claim amazing psychic abilities, but the writers could have tried to be a little bit less obvious in their choices of names.

 

Nonetheless, I've been calling the Bat-sprog Damien since Mark told me Grant Morrison was introducing him - and it made me burst out with hysterical laughter when I saw that I was right on the money.

 

Oh, and Alfred reading Artemis Fowl totally cracks me up. Love those books!

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How was Lapham's run on Batman? I remember you guys were excited about the idea, but I dunno if you all enjoyed it. And I saw it released on trade when I went shopping two days ago, a nice think book it was.

 

 

Naah, it's not worth bothering with. As JMac says, there were some ace moments in the first few issues (mainly involving Robin, with strong support from "Batman drinking tea!"), but the longer it went on, the more obvious it became that the actual story was sprawling and thin, culminating in a deeply underwhelming and unsatisfying non-conclusion. Too many issues+too little story=waste of time and money.

 

 

Second issue of Morrison's Batman was a definite improvement on the first, although the art continues to let the whole thing down badly. Still, some ace dialogue, decent action, a gratifyingly on-the-money version of Bruce/Batman (it's basically the Denny O'Neill/Neal Adams-era '70s Batman, exactly as Morrison promised) and nice work with the supporting characters makes me happy. Two issues in, though, and Paul Dini's Detective is still well ahead on points.

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I keep meaning to sit down and give Lapham's Batman stuff a reread but James' less than enthusiastic comments on the trade kind of put me off - Batman drinking tea and Robin the deranged bomber were both well good. Interupting Lapham's run for two months certainly didn't help.

 

Anyway, but the first Stray Bullets trade instead Baltz!

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Yeah, if you want to read Lapham, read Stray Bullets. The first trade is amazing.

The rest of the series is too (or what I've read), but the first book was the best, if you ask me.

Dark, gritty, sad tales about inner city life, crime, suburbia, and the losers of society.

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and the use of the Lichtenstein pop art as virtual comic panels could have been far more innovative.

I thought the Lichten-like art was used well, humourusly at that.

Take a closer look at what the word bubbles say in the paintings in the background during the fight.

Unless Morrison's making detailed notes, that's about as good as you're going to get from Kubert.

Oh I did very carefully (still have uber vision after re reading Moore's Top Ten) and I still think he could have done much more with it.

Hell it's a great idea in a Batman context.

 

I'm not sure about the overall plot so far though.

 

How or did Talia know that Bruce would be in London?

She couldnt have planned for it, as it was Robin who suggested it to him.

Talia & son were there for Langstrom.

She doesn't look suprised to see Bruce at the gallery.

 

Why reveal Bat boy to Bruce now?

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And can we assume Bruce's secret identity is blown? You don't need to be a genius to make the connection between a famous Gotham citizen and a famous Gotham superhero™ being in London at the same time. Or is Morrison's pop Batman not intended to be read that deeply?

 

If anyone wants to make the "blown" joke with reference to Batman shagging Talia, have it with my compliments.

 

Glad I'm not the only reader who's not impressed by the art. There's nothing particularly wrong with it, it just seems workmanlike.

 

 

actually my comment towards miller may be kinda harsh,he lives in the same free country as me and is entitled to make a comic called rakshade spends all day stirring a bubbling crock of bullshit if he sees fit.

 

however mr.morrisons calling him out in such a ballsy fashion is fantastic.

That gets my vote for most reasonable and even-handed post of the month.

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And can we assume Bruce's secret identity is blown? You don't need to be a genius to make the connection between a famous Gotham citizen and a famous Gotham superhero™ being in London at the same time. Or is Morrison's pop Batman not intended to be read that deeply?

 

If anyone wants to make the "blown" joke with reference to Batman shagging Talia, have it with my compliments.

 

Glad I'm not the only reader who's not impressed by the art. There's nothing particularly wrong with it, it just seems workmanlike.

 

 

actually my comment towards miller may be kinda harsh,he lives in the same free country as me and is entitled to make a comic called rakshade spends all day stirring a bubbling crock of bullshit if he sees fit.

 

however mr.morrisons calling him out in such a ballsy fashion is fantastic.

That gets my vote for most reasonable and even-handed post of the month.

 

Talia already knows Bruce Wayne and Batman are the same person.

That woman who Bruce was talking to was Bruce's cover story. When she's taken from the building she says, "....Bruce Wayne is still in there!"

Surely, that will be all the proof you need that Bruce Wayne cannot be Batman!

 

Yeah, everyone is reading too hard into what Morrison stated he wants to be seen as pop escapist fantasy fiction. Taking the series back towards where it was in the late-1970s.

 

Remember with Human Target when James kept complaining that Milligan wasn't explaining things such as "why are the police doing this or that?", when Milligan's view of reality was skewered? You couldn't think that deeply into the series because Milligan was presenting a world like ours except off-kilter?

Well, it's like Balt said about Morrison's Batman earlier.

 

And, nah, I still think Morrison has a pre-9/11 attitude.

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Without wishing to sound overly John Byrne about this, if you honestly can't accept a superhero's secret identity as One Of Those Things Which Just Doesn't Get Noticed by characters within the comic, you probably shouldn't be reading superhero comics, as they clearly aren't aimed at you.

 

Seriously, it's just one of those things. Get over it, or read something else, because complaining about it is just silly, really. Yes, it's daft and implausible that no-one figures out who Batman really is just by looking at him - same goes for Superman/Clark Kent, Wonder Woman/Diana Prince, and virtually any other superhero ever - but it's also one of the fundamental conceits of the character, and has been for considerably longer than any of us have been alive. It's not going anywhere.

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Seriously, it's just one of those things. Get over it, or read something else, because complaining about it is just silly, really.

Yeah, it certainly would have been, if anyone had actually complained. Who rattled your cage, Mr Grumpy? :)

 

Another "one of those things" in superhero comics is the crisis wherein it looks like the hero's Secret Identity is in peril, and something has to be done to convince Lois / Vicki / the public that they were mistaken. Yes?

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See the last 50 issues of Daredevil.....Oy vey!

 

Batman's not even consistent though. More than just a secret identity, the comic wavers back and forth on if they even want to acknowledge the existence of Batman. He was seen as an "urban legend" for a lot of stories, and the Infinite Crisis happened which made Batman a public figure again, hanging around with Superman, so they dropped the "urban legend" idea now, as no one in England is shocked or surprised at the existence of a Bat-Man.

 

It's the suspension of disbelief that goes with reading superhero stories.

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Without wishing to sound overly John Byrne about this, if you honestly can't accept a superhero's secret identity as One Of Those Things Which Just Doesn't Get Noticed by characters within the comic, you probably shouldn't be reading superhero comics, as they clearly aren't aimed at you.

 

Seriously, it's just one of those things. Get over it, or read something else, because complaining about it is just silly, really. Yes, it's daft and implausible that no-one figures out who Batman really is just by looking at him - same goes for Superman/Clark Kent, Wonder Woman/Diana Prince, and virtually any other superhero ever - but it's also one of the fundamental conceits of the character, and has been for considerably longer than any of us have been alive. It's not going anywhere.

Wonder Woman is a Public figure so for years people knew who or what she was.

 

Clark kent has actually been explained by Morriosn. Clark slouchs, talks with a completely different tone of voice.

 

Superman stands straight up. His tone of voice is more straight forward and he vibrates his face so you can;t see his face. Not to mention Metropolis is a big city. "Look Superman has black hair and doesnt wear glasses!" "well that certainly narrows it down."

 

"Oh My god, dude! Look Batman is tall and muscular!! Why, he simply must be Bruce Wayne!!!" "Why do I even hang out with you..."

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Yeah, different writers have tried to explain it.

The whole thing about Bruce Wayne making himself look like an imcompentent, spoiled, rich brat who doesn't care about anything except himself.

Most people wouldn't think of a cocky, irresponsible playboy when they try to figure out who Batman is.

There is that disconnect in peoples' minds, where they would doubt the proof in front of them due to what they know about the personality of a public individual.

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Forget the explanations of writers, Mark's on point here (even if he is a wee bit grumpy).

 

You just have to accept that it's not our world and leave it at that.

 

Frankly, the most obvious superhero/alternate identity of all time is Superman. Slouching or not, he's still taller than most everybody when he's Clark, and he's often (if not always) spotted in the same area when shit goes down as Superman, he still has the same eye and hair color, and of course their builds are the same. Plus, Superman doesn't even wear a fucking mask! At least Batman actually bothers to conceal his true identity.

Lazy-ass Kryptonians!

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Forget the explanations of writers, Mark's on point here (even if he is a wee bit grumpy).

 

You just have to accept that it's not our world and leave it at that.

 

Frankly, the most obvious superhero/alternate identity of all time is Superman. Slouching or not, he's still taller than most everybody when he's Clark, and he's often (if not always) spotted in the same area when shit goes down as Superman, he still has the same eye and hair color, and of course their builds are the same. Plus, Superman doesn't even wear a fucking mask! At least Batman actually bothers to conceal his true identity.

Lazy-ass Kryptonians!

"Hey that guy is 6'2 and muscular! His eye color and hair color is the same as supemans!! He must be the Man of Steel!!! I tells ya!." "Were you dropped on you're head as a baby?"

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I can't get over the make out scene where Batman's about to tap it and he's buck naked - except for the cowl!

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That made me laugh too. Technically it proves Batman uses his costume for kinky sex, which opens up a whole can of worms.

 

But if you can't read comics without imagining puerile sexual overtones, you probably shouldn't be reading superhero comics, as they clearly aren't aimed at you. :)

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HA!

 

Did you ever read that LOTDK story-arc about Prof. Hugo Strange?

I forget the name off hand. It was like the 2nd or 3rd story-arc of the series.

Doug Moench wrote it....but it was still surprisingly good. It dealt with that exact topic, although removed from Bruce Wayne. Made Prof. Hugo Strange look like such a sick freak.

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But Hugo Strange is a sick freak! lol I'd like to check that out.

 

Christian - are you giving Batman: The Mad Monk a try? I know Monster Men didn't impress you and this picks up right where that left off. But to me it's like Matt Wagner's take on Batman: Year Two. Classic to me but maybe typical to you?

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Yes, Grinning. Prey! From the days when LOTDK could do no wrong!

 

But Hugo Strange is a sick freak! lol I'd like to check that out.

 

Christian - are you giving Batman: The Mad Monk a try? I know Monster Men didn't impress you and this picks up right where that left off. But to me it's like Matt Wagner's take on Batman: Year Two. Classic to me but maybe typical to you?

 

I was going to ask you about this.

I didn't have enough money to pick it up this week, but I was thinking about it. I'll probably end up picking it up next week.

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I think one part of the problem I had with Monster Men was going in expecting something completely different.

Matt Wagner. Prof. Hugo Strange. I just expected something far out and weird.

If I went in expecting a straight Batman story, I wouldn't have been disappointed.

 

The other problem with Monster Men though was that it was so slow! I felt it was very decompressed.

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There a short story in Gotham Knights that had Hugo Strange convinced that Bruce Wayne was Batman.

 

 

 

[ Spoiler :

It was a really good one. He soo convinced he had 100% psycholigcal proof that Bruce Wayne was infact Batman. He has it all figured out. Well Bruce being incredibly smarter than any psychologist. He basically put on the Bruce Wayne role and did it perfectly. So what happened was Huga ended up snapping and finding a spare Batman costume (he had his men take over one of Waynes buildings). Hugo then thought HE was batman. And in order for Batman to trick him again. Bruce had the Batmobile get blown up. Hugo then went nuts and kept on yelling "I killed Batman! I killed Batman!!!"

]

 

It basically showed you that not only can Batman kick your ass phsyically. But pschologically has well.

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hmmm....That's pretty similar to the Batman:The Animated Series episode that featured Prof. Hugo Strange.

The one with the "dream machine".

Not exactly, but pretty similar.

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It was during Devin Greysons run on the title. years before Gotham Knights became Hush Knights. She was actually a pretty good Batman writer.

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