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Uriel

Constantine Rating

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I know I´m in minority in the world, but I´m with Shanice here and think those LOTR movies are too much overrated. The first movie was good, the second weak, and Return of the King is the most "clichetesque" movie in contemporany era, even more than Titanic (hence those batch of Oscars, what says a lot about what the movies really are...) - I hate that Legolas who only says two words in the whole movie (ahem) and that idiotic scene of them with the elephants (sp?). And the whole happy end, with a marriage and so... :icon_rolleyes:

 

I didn´t read the books before, and won´t read because of the movies, at least not in a near future.

 

There were good points and Peter Jackson made wonders with the production (and the credit goes for him), but the cast was bad (aside for Sean Bean), and there were too much "soap talk" and overacting to be really a great movie.

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To be fair there was a hell of lot more depth and substance to use in shaping a great movie than the still ongoing Constantine series.

 

...

 

I was going to make a snide comment about there being no movie without the creative endeavours of Alan Moore et all on John Constantine but, in fairness, the flick owes far more to Angel than the Hellblazer comic.

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LOTR was a masterwork written by one man - with one vision.  To be fair there was a hell of lot more depth and substance to use in shaping a great movie than the still ongoing Constantine series.

Yeah. 200+ issues has definitely not provided the writers of "Constantine" with enough good material. I mean, it would have taken an hour of movie time to run through everything John Constantine has done in the last fifteen years of comics, so it's no wonder the screenwriters struck out on their own.

 

Please, please, please try to engage the brain before reaching for the keyboard.

 

Edit: It does occur to me that by "depth and substance" you may be talking about money. In which case, I see your point of view.

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Tears is obviously just being a trolling [over-used word] now, so fuck him.

 

The first movie was good, the second weak, and Return of the King is the most "clichetesque" movie in contemporany era, even more than Titanic (hence those batch of Oscars, what says a lot about what the movies really are...)

 

Tolkein probably invented the cliches that you're talking about.

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Actually, rereading that post from Tears, I think he/she might be saying that the LOTR novels had a 'lot more depth and substance' to play with than the Hellblazer comics do, and I couldn't disagree there.

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Tolkein probably invented the cliches that you're talking about.

I disagree. Return of the King was a big war film, with wicked inappriopriate nods to things like the Normandy Invasion, and was by far the weakest of the three films. Still, Tears is definitely wrong when he says that it had more cliches than Titanic.

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Actually, rereading that post from Tears, I think he/she might be saying that the LOTR novels had a 'lot more depth and substance' to play with than the Hellblazer comics do, and I couldn't disagree there.

'To work with.' But considering the paperthin background of your average film, Hellblazer has more than enough material to make a dozen interesting ones.

 

Or you could ignore all of it and make one crappy one.

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Surely the second one was an even bigger war film?

The second one actually was all about the Anglo-Saxons, and I loved it for that. It included the cost of war, and the compromises we make. But the Battle of the Pellinore Fields, with Legolas surfing up and down the Oliphant, the orcs coming across to Osgiliath in WWII-era Marine landing boats a la D-Day, was waaaay too much.

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Actually, rereading that post from Tears, I think he/she might be saying that the LOTR novels had a 'lot more depth and substance' to play with than the Hellblazer comics do, and I couldn't disagree there.

 

I could. Some little bummers have a crush on each other and go on a bit of an adventure. It's fun and all but it isn't life changing. It's all pretty much black and white, good vs evil stuff (with the exception of the Boromir and Smaegol sub-plots). A ripping good yarn to be sure but hardly the complex study of morality and belief that Hellblazer can be at the top of it's game.

 

Hellblazer changed my life, maaaan.

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Tears is obviously just being a trolling [over-used word] now, so fuck him.

 

The first movie was good, the second weak, and Return of the King is the most "clichetesque" movie in contemporany era, even more than Titanic (hence those batch of Oscars, what says a lot about what the movies really are...)

 

Tolkein probably invented the cliches that you're talking about.

 

Glad you resorted to your intellect to express your confusion of an open discussion. I have repeatedly said this is MY OPINION. If it makes me a trolling C**T for saying what feel than I pity the society you'd create if given the chance. I fucking hate that word more than any other, not that you'd even know what it means.

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Tolkein probably invented the cliches that you're talking about.

I disagree. Return of the King was a big war film, with wicked inappriopriate nods to things like the Normandy Invasion, and was by far the weakest of the three films. Still, Tears is definitely wrong when he says that it had more cliches than Titanic.

Get your names right - I never said that.

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Actually, rereading that post from Tears, I think he/she might be saying that the LOTR novels had a 'lot more depth and substance' to play with than the Hellblazer comics do, and I couldn't disagree there.

Thanks for understanding what I meant and not what I possibly said. Everything is not an attack, just an opinion worded badly.

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Actually, rereading that post from Tears, I think he/she might be saying that the LOTR novels had a 'lot more depth and substance' to play with than the Hellblazer comics do, and I couldn't disagree there.

 

I could. Some little bummers have a crush on each other and go on a bit of an adventure. It's fun and all but it isn't life changing. It's all pretty much black and white, good vs evil stuff (with the exception of the Boromir and Smaegol sub-plots). A ripping good yarn to be sure but hardly the complex study of morality and belief that Hellblazer can be at the top of it's game.

 

Hellblazer changed my life, maaaan.

 

LOTR changed a lot people's lives as well, so reducing their love of that literature to some snide remark doesn't help your argument here much. If you really want people to understand your loves, than maybe you might try and understand theirs.

 

Tolken created an entire world removed from our own with every angle and nuance fully realized. There is an actual plot that threads throughout the books, taking the main characters on an oddessy that introduces them to things they've never seen, feelings and emotions they've never felt. The journey challenges them to grow, it changes their ideas, their beliefs, it broadens their world. Not to be a trolling c**t, but that is a much easier storyline to adapt. It is rich with visuals, emotions, ideas and the plot is clear and relatable.

 

Constantine is a collection of stories set in today's dark and depressing world. It is more about mood and tone than plot. That's not a bad thing, it's just harder to adapt. That's what I was saying. Now let's see how this gets twisted around...

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QUOTE(Qusoor @ Nov 30 2004, 01:30 PM

I disagree.  [i)

Return of the King[/i] was a big war film, with wicked inappriopriate nods to things like the Normandy Invasion, and was by far the weakest of the three films.  Still, Tears is definitely wrong when he says that it had more cliches than Titanic.

Get your names right - I never said that.

Whups! My absolute bad. My apologies.

 

Ocean, you have no idea what you're talking about.

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Constantine is a collection of stories set in today's dark and depressing world.  It is more about mood and tone than plot.  That's not a bad thing, it's just harder to adapt.  That's what I was saying.  Now let's see how this gets twisted around...

Aaaand here's where I think you've only read Garth Ennis's work. In most of the other writers' work (Azzarello excepted), this has most definitely not been true. With Carey, Ellis, Delano and most especially Alan Moore, the atmosphere is important, but it's not as imporant as the plot. Constantine is about the twist, and about John outsmarting someone. How John reacts to things as a moral human being is very important, and Carey especially (see Red Sepulchre) tells stories that hammer home the need to be prepared, to be smart, and to know things.

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Constantine is a major motion picture from Warner Brothers studios, Hellblazer is collection of stories set in today's dark and depressing world.

 

Look, I'm not dissing anyone's love of Tolien here, it's lovely and all and I've read them over and over too but, much as I enjoyed the films, if I see Sean Astin shooting Elijah Wood another soulful look I might not be responsible for my actions. I'm all for subversively playing up the subtext of Tolkien's alledged crush on CS Lewis but some subtlety would have been nice.

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You're just upset because them little Hoblits are Tolkein's representation of The Welsh etc etc.

 

And the Trolls are germans, not americans.

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