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jae

another one bites the dust....

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I wish Vertigo would pay David Lapham to work on Stray Bullets.

Well they are paying him to work on a new monthly.Young Liars,issue # 1 on sale March 12th 2008,full color.

 

Not sure if you are aware and lamenting that it's not Stray Bullets,or if you might not be aware,but it looks decent enough.

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I wish that also, John.

But yeah, thanks for posting that Rak. I thought Lapham had a new series coming up from Vertigo. Hopefully, it'll be good.

Lapham had a graphic novel come out from Vertigo last year. Anyone read that? I'm waiting for the soft cover.

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I think having an unlikable character gives it more of story. I have to agree i cant stand superman due to that fact. make superman into a complete jerk adds some story to the character

 

That's funny. I thought Superman was a jerk!

You know, it's just because the character is 60 years old. He started out an evil social democrat that the American people today would've hated for his liberalism, but slowly, he turned conservative and acceptable. Just like the social democrats in real life!

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Christian,I believe Silverfish was Laphems ogn last year.I heve not read it and was waiting for someone to tell me it was brilliant and that I had to go get it,but that never happened.

 

Also Superman is at the top of my "comic characters I cannot bring myself to care about" list,but please show some respect for the extremely close second place showing of Spiderman.

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It's weird. A small part of me gets irked when people diss Superman.

 

Is it a knee-jerk, childhood thing?

 

Well, something's obviously gone wrong!

 

No. I kid. I really don't have the hatred of Superman I once did. I've gotten over it in my 30-plus days.

Grant Morrison won me over to your side.

There are some good Superman stories from over the years. All-Star Superman is easily the best superhero book of the 2000s, so far.

I'm still not a huge fan of the character, but All-Star Superman convinced me to try the Showcase Presents: Superman book, and I think it's great crazy/goofy fun. And, Otto Binder is always tops in my book.

Plus, I have been awakened to the fact by others on this Forum (from a thread long, long ago) that, in Superman's earliest days, the guy fought for the working class against coporations and government corruption (even if he was still a nationalist isolationist).

I'm even seriously thinking about buying the James Robinson upcoming run.

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Well they are paying him to work on a new monthly.Young Liars,issue # 1 on sale March 12th 2008,full color.

Yeah, and I'm sure it'll be good too - or at least better than his Batman run ended up being!

 

Stray Bullets is something special though, easily on a par with anything ever published by Vertigo.

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I'm really wondering how Silverfish was. That'd be the litmus test.

Lapham hasn't done very good work outside Stray Bullets. I'm marking it down as Lapham doesn't do well on company owned products, but really, he hasn't impressed outside of Stray Bullets.

Stray Bullets does stand out as one of the top comic book series though, so that's always worth high praise.

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well we all read hellblazer and john is not a likable person at all. My most favortie dc comic ever was starman...

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Plus, I have been awakened to the fact by others on this Forum (from a thread long, long ago) that, in Superman's earliest days, the guy fought for the working class against coporations and government corruption (even if he was still a nationalist isolationist).

There's also the fact that the first person he's seen roughing up was a wifebeater (that's his car getting wrecked on the first cover, I believe).

 

I've always thought a big part of Superman's appeal is that he's the ultimate childish power fantasy, which is what superhero comics are all about in the first place, don't ever let anybody tell you otherwise.

 

 

jae: good point.

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Gaimans Morpheous is the single most frustrating character I have ever enjoyed while reading fiction.Poet,I had no idea about the car thing,that's fascinating.

 

Also,there bringing back House of Mystery.

 

Also,it aint sticking around.

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It's weird. A small part of me gets irked when people diss Superman.

 

Is it a knee-jerk, childhood thing?

It might depend on when your childhood was. Superman even in the 1960s was different from what he is now.

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It took me quite a long time to figure out that I don't hate Superman, I'm just not a fan of John Byrne's Superman. I love a lot of the older Golden/Silver Age stuff, and there've been some excellent Superman stories from the last few years (Morrison's All-Star Superman is, as Christian says, easily the best superhero comic of the 21st Century so far, and both Kurt Busiek and Geoff Johns have been doing great work on Superman and Action Comics over the last two years). But most of what I saw from the period between Byrne's mid/late-'80s revamp and the more recent, post-Birthright version of the character turned me right off. It was the Justice League animated series which really turned me around, I think.

 

I've always had a certain (ummm, I don't want to use the word "respect" - far too Byrne - but it's the best I can come up with right now) for the idea of Superman - he is still the archetypal superhero, after all - but it's only relatively recently that's turned into genuine fondness for the character himself. It was a combination of Morrison's JLA and the Justice League animated series which really turned me around, I think.

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It took me quite a long time to figure out that I don't hate Superman, I'm just not a fan of John Byrne's Superman. I love a lot of the older Golden/Silver Age stuff, and there've been some excellent Superman stories from the last few years (Morrison's All-Star Superman is, as Christian says, easily the best superhero comic of the 21st Century so far, and both Kurt Busiek and Geoff Johns have been doing great work on Superman and Action Comics over the last two years). But most of what I saw from the period between Byrne's mid/late-'80s revamp and the more recent, post-Birthright version of the character turned me right off. It was the Justice League animated series which really turned me around, I think.

 

I've always had a certain (ummm, I don't want to use the word "respect" - far too Byrne - but it's the best I can come up with right now) for the idea of Superman - he is still the archetypal superhero, after all - but it's only relatively recently that's turned into genuine fondness for the character himself. It was a combination of Morrison's JLA and the Justice League animated series which really turned me around, I think.

Now that's interesting as I think (the occasional misfire and barring Alan Moore from ever writing any more Superman aside), Byrne's take wasn't at all shabby. I really liked his Mxzyltllptypo, Metallo and Luther revamps, for a start.

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Oh, I think he did some excellent comics during his tenure - I just don't like his version of the character himself much. There's still some good stuff in there, though - he did a short back-up strip in (I think) one of his Action Comics issues which is one of the best Lex Luthor stories I've ever read, Cat Grant and Maggie Sawyer were worthy additions to the supporting cast, and the first meeting between Superman and Batman in the Man Of Steel mini is lots of fun. It's just that there's also stuff like the Big Barda porn/mind-control story, which really pissed me off when I finally read it a couple of years ago, and the story wherein Superman decides upon his Code Against Killing after murdering three people in cold blood was an...uhh...odd creative choice. That and the way Byrne turned Clark Kent into a cool, confident, attractive guy which, along with a few other changes, left me pretty cold.

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Oh, I think he did some excellent comics during his tenure - I just don't like his version of the character himself much. There's still some good stuff in there, though - he did a short back-up strip in (I think) one of his Action Comics issues which is one of the best Lex Luthor stories I've ever read, Cat Grant and Maggie Sawyer were worthy additions to the supporting cast, and the first meeting between Superman and Batman in the Man Of Steel mini is lots of fun. It's just that there's also stuff like the Big Barda porn/mind-control story, which really pissed me off when I finally read it a couple of years ago, and the story wherein Superman decides upon his Code Against Killing after murdering three people in cold blood was an...uhh...odd creative choice. That and the way Byrne turned Clark Kent into a cool, confident, attractive guy which, along with a few other changes, left me pretty cold.

I actually can tolerate the code against killing piece: it's deeply stupid, but it provides a reason which (given the tenor of the times, particularly in comics) rationalises something that could otherwise be taken on faith as an abstract moral matter somebody who's impervious to gundfire and can squeeze coal into diamonds would arrive at after ten minutes thought, being a genius and everything. (I'm doing Byrne no favours here, I admit.)

(Dead right about the other listed clangers, though I'm not sure that trying to update Clark from an unspeakable 'forties nerd into somebody Lois might actually countenance speaking to civilly was entirely a bad idea, despite the execution having a faint whiff of crappiness to it.)

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Christian,I believe Silverfish was Laphems ogn last year.I heve not read it and was waiting for someone to tell me it was brilliant and that I had to go get it,but that never happened.

 

It's not quite brilliant, but it is very good. It has the usual OGN problem of not having enough room to fully flesh out all of the characters, so that the events seem slightly inconsequential.

 

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Hmmn. Perhaps I still have this huge fondness for Superman because I just don't really read that much Superman (I actually got one of Azzarello's graphic novels out from the library recently but couldn't finish it!)

 

Maybe I just like Christopher Reeve.

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I consider Superman like the blues: a necessary step in the evolution of its genre: even though it never seems to change, all the stories have the same structure formula (like the 12 bar blues), I respect the role Superman played in bringing me the comics I DO enjoy more, like X-Men, Punisher, Batman, etc. (like blues led me to jazz, folk, rock, metal, punk)

 

And as I enjoy some blues artists (BB King, Ella Fitzgerald, Aretha Franklin), I enjoy some incarnations of Superman (Kingdom Come, Morrison/Quitely).

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But then I like Batman best when he is being a dick. I know he models himself on Sherlock Holmes, but he's more the Gregory House M.D of vigilantes.

Which is cool (perhaps the shared appeal is that they're both being a dick on purpose?)

 

Anyway, Vinyl Underground next to go?

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But then I like Batman best when he is being a dick. I know he models himself on Sherlock Holmes, but he's more the Gregory House M.D of vigilantes.

Which is cool (perhaps the shared appeal is that they're both being a dick on purpose?)

 

Anyway, Vinyl Underground next to go?

Since I would rather read that book,than say Un-men,I would wager that it will be the next to go.This is using the logic you did in post #92,which makes perfect sense.

 

EDIT:No wait,I'm confused.Are you changing your pick because Un-men was already cancelled?Was it cancelled?

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No Un-Men hasn't been cancelled to my knowledge! With my Vinyl Underground comment I was just tyring to get myself back on topic after comparing Batman to Hugh Laurie with an American accent in a thread about Vertigo series.

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Yeah, let's give it up for those Un-Men :

 

227 - THE UN-MEN (Vertigo)

08/2007: The Un-Men #1 — 11,868

09/2007: The Un-Men #2 — 8,758 (-26.2%)

10/2007: The Un-Men #3 — 7,566 (-13.6%)

11/2007: The Un-Men #4 — 6,678 (-11.7%)

12/2007: The Un-Men #5 — 6,094 (- 8.8%)

01/2008: The Un-Men #6 — 5,525 (- 9.3%)

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I was wondering who would actually buy that series. Not because it's a horrible book, or even the worst of current Vertigo comics, but just because the concept/title doesn't seem like it has a lot of reader appeal.

I'm really quite shocked it sold so high originally.

I didn't think it was bad, I just gave it up after the first issue because it didn't hook me, and my patience with Vertigo books has been severely tested.

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