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jaynova

I love Grant Morrison, but...

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dogpoet    442

Oh dear. Do you think that somebody might be trying to compensate for that he isn't Grant Morrison's mini me anymore?

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Atticus    164

Speaking of which, I read that Fox have taken on Mark Millar to oversee their "superhero universe", guiding the X-Men and the soon-to-be-rebooted Fantastic Four franchises in much the same way that Christopher Nolan and Joss Wheedon are doing elswehere for Superman/Batman and Avengers.

 

The fact that he's a comic writer, not a movie maker, does not seem to have deterred Fox. I foresee a poor time ahead for these two movie properties (although I wil doff my hat in respect to him if he manages to achieve some success).

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dogpoet    442

I'm not sure it's that bad a fit: Millar's rise to his current prominence started when he was given the filmalikeUltimate X Men to write, didn't it?

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Atticus    164

Maybe I am being unfair, but I haven't been that impressed with Millar for a long time (and consequently I haven't read Ultimate X-Men). I just think that while he can undoubtably turn in a good story he lacks subtlety. Even his good stories feel like being beaten over the head after a few issues.

 

Nolan & Whedon have a wealth of experience in actually making TV & film, so to hear that Fox is trying to match their success by appointing someone whose experience seems to be limited to working closely with Matthew Vaughn reminds me of John Barnes taking over at Celtic i.e. not terribly encouraging and ends in failure.

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Christian    734

I'm in agreement with you about Mark Millar's writing ability.

The Ultimates was the best work he produced. All his other work seems derivative of something someone else once did better, and now Millar is taking his turn at that concept.

I suppose it could even be argued that The Ultimates fits in that frame.

 

Although, Dog's point is valid. Marvel once gave him a lot of creative power at their company with their characters, and the results seemed to be impressive, as far as appealing to mass tastes in superheroes and hooking readers.

He might not have the experience with movies, but he has experience with those characters, and making them popular with most casual fans, rather than just us hardcore types who have been reading the characters since the 1980s (or whenever).

And, if I'm not mistaken, he had a role in the making of Kick-Ass into a movie.

 

Besides, with how bad the FF film franchise was, it's not like sticking Millar on that can be a bad thing.

Millar has written some decent FF stories in his time, and it's obvious that the old people behind the FF films had no idea about a decent FF story.

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dogpoet    442

Millar has written some decent FF stories in his time....

When was that, then?

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Christian    734

You didn't like his run on Fantastic Four?

It wasn't in the same league as the classic runs (Lee, Kirby, Conway, Byrne, Waid), but I thought it worked fairly well as a modern FF run.

I'd honestly probably rank it as near to equal with the Hickman run, which I have found consistently hit or miss.

Hickman's run started out as really good, when it was telling self-contained stories, but once the book hit the "death of Johnny Storm" story, the quality became a lot more shaky.

Plus, he wrote a couple of stories on Ultimate Fantastic Four, which weren't bad at all. Not as good as the Carey run, but still, not bad. He wasn't on the book very long though, I think just two stories.

Of course, outside Carey, the only writers to compare to on UFF were Bendis and Ellis...

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dogpoet    442

Come off it, Christian: If you're having Gerry Conway as a classic run and saying Millar isn't even that good, that isn't really a glowing recommendation, is it?

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Christian    734

Have you read the Gerry Conway issues of Fantastic Four? I love them. I think they hold up well next to Lee & Kirby.

Hickman stated when he started on FF that the Conway run in the '70s was his favourite period on FF, and that was the feel he was trying to recapture on the title. He even had the little bubble heads of the main characters put around the title logo, in homage to how the comic looked during the 1970s.

Now, have you actually read the Conway run on FF, or are you just being antagonistic? "Because it's not Lee & Kirby or Byrne, so internet fans have to pretend that everything else in FF sucked."

 

Hell, there's even a character (giant golden space gorilla, actually) named Gor associated with Counter-Earth, so you must love Conway's run just for that, eh?

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dogpoet    442

I've read some of Conway's run (the Marvel UK magazines were reprinting it when I was little, and the Essentials cover his run), and I've always found it a bit underwhelming. Sure, it has its moments, but its still pretty by numbers stuff. (Though it is a lot better than Roy Thomas managed.)

Outside of Lee/Kirby and Byrne, I'd have said the best FF run is by Walt Simonson.

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Christian    734

Simonson's run was definitely fun. I forgot to rank that as a classic, but I'd still rank Simonson below Conway and Waid.

 

My list would look like this:

1.Lee/Kirby

2.Byrne

3.Conway

4.Waid

5.Simonson

6.Millar

7.Hickman

Then, everything else vies for from bad to worst.

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Christian    734

Multiversity is now scheduled for late-2013 release, which confuses me.

Is this because Morrison doesn't want to write this project, so he's placing it after the end of 2012?

Or, is it that Morrison no longer believes the end of the world is coming in December?

It seems odd he would make plans for post-2012.

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Atticus    164

I guess it's because he doesn't really believe the world will end in 2012. Like everyone who jumped on the Mayan armageddon bandwagon, once everyone else realised it was all made up (ok, let's be charitable, we'll say "misinterpreted") they quietly forgot about it.

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dogpoet    442

Let's not be charitable: Terence McKenna's "research" for that one made Erich von Daniken look like Wade Davis...

:icon_wink:

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slinker    893

2012 is just going to be a polar shift, that's all. yes, many of you will die so it will seem like the end of the world, but those of us who survive will be part of a great awakening. ironically, Morrison will be in an airplane when it happens and will be an unfortunate casualty missing out on a world he'd be fond of experiencing. The SPHYNX has spoken.

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Christian    734

What? Taking a bunch of drugs in a country not your birthplace doesn't count as reputable research anymore? What's this world coming to?

I don't know...plagiarizing a bunch of occult literature that he probably didn't even bother to finish reading, and promoting an outdated racialist world-view seems like the less verifiable of the two.

At least McKenna had some basically original writings. I know a few other authors had written about December 2012 and a Mayan apocalypse, but the ideas Von Daniken claimed to popularize had been floating around in UFO-related circles since the 1950s, at least. A fascist author named Robert Charroux even sued Von Daniken.

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dogpoet    442

Von Daniken's sources go back a lot further than the '50s, Christian. I thought you'd read Lovecraft?

 

As for McKenna, I'd find his claims a lot more credible if he hadn't revised his time wave zero theory so that the dates some haxor d00dhe got from running the I Ching through a computer weren't altered (along with the programme that obtained them) to match the Mayan end date when he found out about that one six or seven months later. The man's so full of shit that he squelches when he walks.

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Christian    734

I've heard the whole "Oh, Von Daniken just stole ideas from Lovecraft" idea before...I think it was first proposed by one of those skeptics who gives skeptics a bad name in Skeptical Inquirer.

I swear, those guys are out to discredit skepticism, not to be the hardcore skeptics they claim to be.

They always go in really roundabout ways to debunk paranormal claims, ways that show a seeming total lack of research into the subject material. There are always so many better ways to debunk these claims than those guys choose to pursue.

I'm not sure exactly how Von Daniken just copied from Lovecraft, other than they used some of the same source material.

Both of them were cribbing from occult literature.

Hence, it goes back before Lovecraft, as far as sources, since Lovecraft used those sources as inspiration, himself.

But, outside that, I don't see a direct connection between Lovecraft and Von Daniken. Von Daniken copied his ideas, certainly, but not from Lovecraft.

 

What I was saying about the 1950s was that there were a lot of writers who had already used up those ideas in the UFO field by that early a point, and Von Daniken was simply a plagarist who somehow caught the mass public's attention, while all those other UFO writers mostly stayed within UFO fandom.

It's not even so much that Von Daniken used spurious sources to arrive at his conclusions, it's the fact that a large number of other writers had already done all the leg-work, and Von Daniken was able to just cram together a little book copying the work of other authors, and then claiming himself as a "popularizer".

 

While I haven't directly read the Charroux books )too much fascism for my taste, I guess), Von Daniken apparently plagiarized his work so badly that Charroux won a lawsuit against him.

I have read quite a few other UFO writers who pre-dated Von Daniken, like W. Raymond Drake for example, who had already done a far more thorough job of using up the ideas that Von Daniken would come along later and publish and make millions off of.

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Atticus    164

That'll be Grant Morrison MBE? He does look very dapper here:

morrison-mbe.jpg

 

I'd wear that medal all the time if I were him.

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slinker    893

Have you guys seen his movie yet? I posted the youtube link in Yakoo Smacko and Dot.

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Rogan    176

I love-love-LOVE Grant Morrison, but...

 

...I've just seen him at the very start of the latest Frankie Boyle DVD, praising him as a genius, the modern-day Lenny Bruce (followed by his wife, I believe, also with a glowing praise that he says what we all are thinking), and it made me a bit sad.

 

 

And Happy #2 was an okay read, though it's all still a bit light on plot/mindfuckery.

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