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Hellblazer 298 rating

For completeness sake, how would you rate this on the traditional straight to hell scale  

5 members have voted

  1. 1. On a scale of 0 to 10 where 1 is poor and 10 is excellent ...

    • 0 - I did not buy it.
      1
    • 10 - The Orient Express
      0
    • 9 - The Flying Scotsman
      0
    • 8 - Von Ryan's Express
      0
    • 7 - Thomas The Tank Engine
      0
    • 6 - Silver Streak
      0
    • 5 - Eurostar
      0
    • 4 - Docklands Light Railway
      1
    • 3 - Ghost Train
      0
    • 2 - Llanfairpwllgwyngyllgogerychwyrndrobwllllantysiliogogocrap
      0
    • 1 - A train wreck
      3


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Hellblazer #298-

So, John causes a train wreck and people are dying all around him, and he doesn't care....OK. We're starting out really, really stupid.

 

Hey, John just said he's over 60 years old. What's going on with the time-line?

 

Man, they've totally ret-conned Jenkins whole run, haven't they? Kit, Angie, Phoebe, Piffy....Notice there's no mention of Dani on the list. So weird....

 

Yeah, I can't say that was a good issue. It wasn't the worst of issues, when John was going around by himself....but the scenes with John and Epiphany were pretty bad.

And, that beginning is dreck.

I'll give this issue a four on the scale-that-does-not-exist.

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yes, it was quite unremarkable. There are even beings innit who seem to be supernatural and similar to the Furies who dole out death on a tight schedule.

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Hellblazer #298-

So, John causes a train wreck and people are dying all around him, and he doesn't care....OK. We're starting out really, really stupid.

 

Hey, John just said he's over 60 years old. What's going on with the time-line?

 

Man, they've totally ret-conned Jenkins whole run, haven't they? Kit, Angie, Phoebe, Piffy....Notice there's no mention of Dani on the list. So weird....

 

Yeah, I can't say that was a good issue. It wasn't the worst of issues, when John was going around by himself....but the scenes with John and Epiphany were pretty bad.

And, that beginning is dreck.

I'll give this issue a four on the scale-that-does-not-exist.

 

The only time Dani was mentioned was in the conclusion of Scab. Her and Rich, come to think of it.

 

As far as most of us are concerned, John's still doing his own thing post Diggle, new gf, new adversary, Gemma's the same as we last saw her under Carey and Milligan's entire run never happened. It's not canon. Get thee away from me, Milligan!

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Now that I look back on Milligans run he seems to think the character needed some "real life" in him. IE: the concept of not tying up loose ends, because real life never has loose ends tied up.

 

The problem with that thinking; is that this is a comic book and the readers WANT to have their stories conclude and be tied. He just didn't do that, he have John escape death and then instantly move on to some other story. And while that is OK to do. It only works IF the previous story set up the chain reaction for the next few stories.

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No. He means that the "New 52" has changed everything. Hellblazer will be gone in two months time, and with it, all vestiges of our John Constantine.

From that point forward, the "New 52" John Constantine will solely be canon.

So, everything from Hellblazer will no longer be canon accorded to the vested authorities, which is DC Comics.

Sad, but true, if we use the term "canon".

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Thing is wolvy there have been plenty of loose ends especially when writers left - notably Azz's mysterious person watching JC in a couple of issues. And there have been nicely tied up ends that have been unravelled by incoming writers - Carey's magic moratorium and Diggle's positive recovery. Milligan's had the largest number of these other than Carey's, which was a plot point - but he has been in the book for a while.

 

I think you are right about the real life thing, but it is a tv series idea of real life.

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Just got round to reading it.

Looks like Milligan just doesn't give a fuck after all.

 

I know John has a history of sacrficing others to achieve an end, but causing a train crash, killing and maiming a whole load of folk just to prove to Epiphany that he can't die today is a bit fucking much. He could've just cut his own throat.

 

I've gone along with all the crazy plot turns and out-of-character behaviour that Milligan has thrown our way, but this is perhaps the worst of the lot. Say what you like about the forthcoming Constantine, but I find it hard to believe it be any worse than this pile of wank (uness Nick Necro puts in an early appearance).

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Just got round to reading it.

Looks like Milligan just doesn't give a fuck after all.

 

I know John has a history of sacrficing others to achieve an end, but causing a train crash, killing and maiming a whole load of folk just to prove to Epiphany that he can't die today is a bit fucking much. He could've just cut his own throat.

 

I've gone along with all the crazy plot turns and out-of-character behaviour that Milligan has thrown our way, but this is perhaps the worst of the lot. Say what you like about the forthcoming Constantine, but I find it hard to believe it be any worse than this pile of wank (uness Nick Necro puts in an early appearance).

 

That's bound to happen anyway.

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No. John caught him and put him in jail.

 

As horrible as "New 52" John is....you have to admit that there hasn't actually been anything as stupid as the train crash scene even in Justice League Dark.

Yes, the origin is godawfully painful to even think about....but John just casually walking around, so self-centered, while people are dying around him, caused by the train crash he caused....that's the low point of Hellblazer, right there.

At this point, I just expect utter stupidity from Hellblazer, so when I get an issue that isn't totally devoid of any good character moments, I just try to block the horrid crud that preceded it from my mind.

But, yeah, that scene does deserve an award when HB ends....as worst scene in the entire run.

John is not anywhere near as interesting a character in the "New 52", but I do have to admit that the train crash scene is more out-of-character than anything I've yet seen in Justice League Dark...even the "I want to get a matching tattoo with Zatanna and join your coven, Nick Necro!".

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Yes. Mindwarp. Great Mindwarp. The greatest character ever created by modern man. If Mindwarp didn't exist, we'd be forced to create him. He is indeed the one who is to blame for the downfall of Milligan.

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Haven't received the issue yet, but John causing a massacre just to prove he can't die is pretty fucking stupid. I know some writers like to think that John can be a right prick sometimes. But, causing people to die to prove a point to your 20 something wife. Goes way beyond being a prick and into the sociopath territory. And not even the worst writers went that far with his character.

 

There really could have been a better way for him to try to prove he can't die. Though, I like Delano's idea the best. John can and has died. He just knows all the roads in Hell and Heaven, so it's easy for him to return, or he can simply strike a deal with another Demon/Angel or something.

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The whole "John can't die" thing is part of the issue's plot. It's not that John can never die, it's that the Furies Men in Black three strangers have marked him to die at a certain point, in a certain way, so John cannot die until that moment.

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John causing a massacre just to prove he can't die is pretty fucking stupid. I know some writers like to think that John can be a right prick sometimes. But, causing people to die to prove a point to your 20 something wife. Goes way beyond being a prick and into the sociopath territory. And not even the worst writers went that far with his character.

 

Milligan thinks he knows the character better than the fans do. All he's made is a forgettable John who has become increasingly unlikable.

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Exactly. I don't know what book Milligan has been reading, but John is driven by a need to survive, he isn't self-centered. John wouldn't be going around all mopey because the Three Stooges Three Wisemen three strangers have marked him for death. He'd be proactive. Even if he doomed, he would try until his dying breath, and then expire in a respectful manner. He isn't going to wander around a scene of a train wreck with dying bodies (never mind that he caused the event!) going, "Woe is me! Everything is so awful for me! Only I matter!". He doesn't seem to understand the gaping nuances (heh) that separate self-interest from self-centered.

Add that to the outright sociopathic murder of a complete stranger earlier in the run, and yeah, Milligan has turned John into a blatantly unlikable character that bears no resemblance to any incarnation. Even with the shades that different writers have brought to John, an innate character has been a part of each run....with the exception of Azzarello. But, even that unlikable cipher wasn't as blatantly obnoxious or unfeeling as the puppet-like John Constantine of Peter Milligan.

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Yes. Mindwarp. Great Mindwarp. The greatest character ever created by modern man. If Mindwarp didn't exist, we'd be forced to create him. He is indeed the one who is to blame for the downfall of Milligan.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?hl=en-GB&gl=GB&v=mtnCcWOS7y8

?

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Hi- yes, I'm new. I read Hellblazer from the start up to about ish 130, then left it, picking up only the ocassional trade or wotnot. News of the cancellation made me pick it up again regularly (aint it always the way?) and I very much give a shit. Just read #298 and have to say that in my reading of it, John does NOT cause the deaths of all those people on the train. The train was always going to derail at that moment. John had no way of knowing that, he just knows it's unlikely he will be killed prior to the date he has dreamed. It just so happens that this "magical idea" alters/ does not alter his reality and he survives because the train was always going to do that. As he says, he didn't think it through- as he could have been horribly injured and on a lifesupport until the day of his predicted death. The point being he didn't do what he's being accused of here. And if you don't believe me, please don't stand in front of a train to test the theory. Train drivers don't have an option to "swerve maniacally because someone's on the line"!

 

Anyway- I'm currently rereading the first year of the book and loving it all over again. But the most recent issues? They more than live up to the legacy. Great stuff.

 

Nice to meetcha.

 

SBT

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You could read it two ways though. Was John changing probability to make a point?

You're saying that John knew the train was going to crash.

Other readers are taking it that John, knowing he could not die, decided to put the lives of the people on the train in danger by testing his belief. If John had not stepped on to those tracks, the train would not have crashed. Fate stepped in and led the train to derail instead of allowing John to be crushed.

You're right. It can be read either way though.

 

But, more to the point, is that John walks around going, "Woe is me! I'm going to die!", while there are people dying all around him. Whether he caused the crash or not, John's character is not to be so whiny and self-centered. That's just an annoying character, not a character I want to read about.

John has never been uncaring about humanity. I'm not saying he should rush into the train and try to rescue people. That'd be out of character also. But, John has never been one to look away from the sight of innocent blood spilled and to just calmly walk away while moping about how bad he's got it.

John is, at least, more proactive. He's been fated to die before, and he's fought to the very end. Even if he did die, it'd be more nobly, rather than crying about how he's a target of the Fates now.

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Nice to meet you, SBT. Sure do wish I could share your enthusiasm on the latest issues of Hellblazer or Constantine.

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In the interests of wanting to be able to comment on this matter, I read the issue in the comic shop today.

 

While there is no on-the-page explanation of the causation pertaining to this train crash, the issue is about fate and as such, if he believed that he would not die, he'd have to believe that those people were going to die whatever. An ethical paradox that does not excuse him walking around their deaths like a [over-used word]. And a [over-used word] trying to impress a dolly bird.

 

I was thinking I might purchase #300 but you can club together and send me a page each if you want me to own a copy.

 

Bring on Constantine #1.

 

PS I also glanced at the latest JLD, since I no longer buy it. I didn't read it all though, I'm not falling for that again.

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Just read #298 and have to say that in my reading of it, John does NOT cause the deaths of all those people on the train. The train was always going to derail at that moment. John had no way of knowing that, he just knows it's unlikely he will be killed prior to the date he has dreamed. It just so happens that this "magical idea" alters/ does not alter his reality and he survives because the train was always going to do that. As he says, he didn't think it through- as he could have been horribly injured and on a lifesupport until the day of his predicted death. The point being he didn't do what he's being accused of here. And if you don't believe me, please don't stand in front of a train to test the theory. Train drivers don't have an option to "swerve maniacally because someone's on the line"!

 

Nice to have you on here SBT. I hadn't thought of reading the events in that way, although I didn't think the train crashed because driver "swerved" to avoid someone on the line. I read it as one of those moments that fate stepped in to ensure events played out the way they were forecast (in an Omen or Final Destination type way), and maybe some points chose that moment to fail, or a worn wheel bearing finally gave out. Standard horror movie trope.

 

That said, I suppose your version is an equally valid interpretation that gives John a get-out clause frm being a self-absorbed heartless wanker. Still a god-awful issue of the comic though.

 

Anyway, welcome to the fold, hope you enjoy yourself but be careful where you sit. Some of those stains are still wet.

 

Ade: I for one don't want you just to OWN a copy of #300 - I want you to put in the effort, shell out your hard-earned cash, and suffer with the rest of us. For no other reason than the solace that I'm not the only mug out there.

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