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Demon Chas08    295

where did you get a real life zatanna? and yeah, where's the pony?

 

That's actually the chick who played Zee on Smallville

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JohnMcMahon    587

Heidi, over on The Beat, points out that Constantine and Swamp thing are...

 

the lowest-selling DCU titles not yet slated for cancellation.

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Demon Chas08    295

Heidi, over on The Beat, points out that Constantine and Swamp thing are...

 

the lowest-selling DCU titles not yet slated for cancellation.

 

Meanwhile at the Legion of Doom DC Headquarters...

 

DiDio: You trecherous basement dwelling bastards! I give you Swampy and Constantine back to the DCU from that imprint I ripped them from and this is how you repay me?!

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Christian    783

Remember when DC had enough books to have different "lines" of titles, like DC:The Dark? Justice League Dark, Constantine, and Swamp Thing are the only books that will be left from The Dark soon. Swamp Thing will probably be next on the chopping block. I expect DC will keep Constantine alive for a while, due to the TV show coming out.

I can't believe Constantine is one of the two lowest selling books though, even if it's sales are really bad.

The majority of DC's line is Superman, Batman, and Justice League though, they have very few other lower-tier books (Green Arrow? Suicide Squad?)....Batman Team Up. Superman Team Up. Superman Team Up:Featuring Batman. Batman Team Up:Featuring Superman.

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Demon Chas08    295

Remember when DC had enough books to have different "lines" of titles, like DC:The Dark? Justice League Dark, Constantine, and Swamp Thing are the only books that will be left from The Dark soon. Swamp Thing will probably be next on the chopping block. I expect DC will keep Constantine alive for a while, due to the TV show coming out.

I can't believe Constantine is one of the two lowest selling books though, even if it's sales are really bad.

The majority of DC's line is Superman, Batman, and Justice League though, they have very few other lower-tier books (Green Arrow? Suicide Squad?)....Batman Team Up. Superman Team Up. Superman Team Up:Featuring Batman. Batman Team Up:Featuring Superman.

 

If DiDiot and co really want to save face, they better revive Hellblazer by either continue from 300 or start a 2nd volume. At this point i see more viewers picking up the trades of the series the show's based on than pick up New 52 Constantine.

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Christian    783

For the first time since #300, I believe that will happen, but it's going to take time.

DC never expècted Constantine to fail so quickly, and I can't see the TV show existing without any comic. I bet DC will hold out until after the show debuts though, expecting to pick up lots of new readers, the show is called Constantine after all. We know this won't happen, so DC will be forced to go back to the drawing board.

I had a nightmare that they relaunched Hellblazer, but based it on the TV show. Let's hope we get the old Hellblazer back, and they don't try to rebuild John from the ground up again.

What I could easily see is that they start vol. 2 by revealing that John faked his death in #300, and has moved to America to start over. That way it could be closer to the TV show, but retain continuity.

As long as they hire quality creative teams and let them do what they want with John Constantine (while keeping Hellblazer's history alive), I'd be fine.

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Demon Chas08    295

For the first time since #300, I believe that will happen, but it's going to take time.

DC never expècted Constantine to fail so quickly, and I can't see the TV show existing without any comic. I bet DC will hold out until after the show debuts though, expecting to pick up lots of new readers, the show is called Constantine after all. We know this won't happen, so DC will be forced to go back to the drawing board.

I had a nightmare that they relaunched Hellblazer, but based it on the TV show. Let's hope we get the old Hellblazer back, and they don't try to rebuild John from the ground up again.

What I could easily see is that they start vol. 2 by revealing that John faked his death in #300, and has moved to America to start over. That way it could be closer to the TV show, but retain continuity.

As long as they hire quality creative teams and let them do what they want with John Constantine (while keeping Hellblazer's history alive), I'd be fine.

 

Starting with China Mieville with Aaron Campbell

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JohnMcMahon    587

I think we'll see a revamped Constantine before any possible new volume of Hellblazer, possibly one that incorporates the Hellblazer name actually.

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Christian    783

Why use the Hellblazer name, when the TV show is called Constantine? If there is a Vertigo relaunch, I expect that book would be titled Constantine also.

They could always try a new creative team and direction (like they did when they didn't want Green Arrow to get cut because there was a TV show), but it just doesn't seem like there's any reader interest for this DC book, so it will probably end up getting really low sales just the same.

It's DC shooting itself in the foot with this policy of any book that dips below a certain level gets cut immediately and replaced (by a new Batman, Superman, or Justice League book...). At first people thought DC was taking a real chance by implementing the policy, then they realized it meant that a lot of quality books would end far too early*, and DC would eventually be forced to rely solely on the only really good sellers in the line to keep a full-line of monthly titles.

 

*I've sort of lost my point by this paragraph, as I'm in no way saying that Constantine is a "quality book"!

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Gwilym    330

They could add a 'John' prefix to differentiate it from the New 52 one

 

and also a 'not by Milligan' suffix to differentiate it from the

 

oh god it's all so complex

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JohnMcMahon    587

Why use the Hellblazer name, when the TV show is called Constantine?

Because all of the show stuff says it's based on Hellblazer!

 

Hellblazer was selling sweet fuck all when they cancelled it, really can't fault them for calling it a day there and trying a relaunch in the DCU.

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slinker    893

it sold fuck all because of milligan. if it had a better writer, things might have been different. people are going apeshit about the show, so there was interest in the character, but milligan made him so unlikable, he killed John's appeal.

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Gwilym    330

Did character likeability and not-being-fucking-terrible have much bearing on sales, though? I'm sure I saw someone around here saying that Azzarello's run saw a huge boost in sales. John was an utter shit in those utterly shit stories.

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A. Heathen    1,162

Milligan's run barely sped up the decline.

Azzarello never restored the numbers they sold in the golden age of Ennis, but he was a popular writer.

 

DC's stupid vanity was that their fucked up shitty DCU continuity and editing would create more of a buzz.

For some of the shittest books ever to bear the name Constantine.

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Christian    783

No, you can't blame DC for trying to reinvent Hellblazer by relaunching it as Constantine. I realize that the numbers at Vertigo were dire and that no one cares about Vertigo any more (unless it's Sandman). But, the DCU Constantine has obviously failed just as well (for reasons, at least partially, stated by Adrian). So, where does that leave DC? Completely reboot the franchise under the New 52 banner again? Return it to Vertigo? You know they aren't going to just cancel John Constantine, outright, since there's a TV show, and I don't see it existing without a comic book.

I just don't see an audience popping up to read the New 52 Constantine book, even if they changed creative teams and direction. It took Swamp Thing about three years to get at this point, while Constantine has barely made it over one year. There weren't a large number of readers for Constantine, even when the book launched, before the readers they did have figured out that book was awful. So, a relaunch written by Charles Soule* with random art isn't going to bring in new readers.

 

*Because I expect DC to just continue to half-ass it with all their books that aren't Batman. Not a knock on Soule, who is a talented writer, but isn't going to change the face of Constantine, and is just a random example of the random talent DC will end up sticking on Constantine.

 

I guess a worst case scenario is just publish Constantine Adventures, featuring adaptations of the TV episodes....

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Christian    783

it sold fuck all because of milligan. if it had a better writer, things might have been different. people are going apeshit about the show, so there was interest in the character, but milligan made him so unlikable, he killed John's appeal.

 

It's not that Milligan is a bad writer. No one could have known beforehand that Milligan was going to fuck up so badly on HB. It's simply that Milligan has never been a "hot" comic creator. He was probably best known way back when Shade was around. There hasn't been any comic titles that have picked up a lot of sales because Milligan was taking over. It's not because he's untalented. I've bought most book that Milligan has written. He just never became a name like Moore, Morrison, Gaiman, Ennis, Azzarello....

Quality rarely equates to high sales in the comic world. Hence, Jenkins' run sold horribly, but Azzarello did great.

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seventhcircle    595

ok i am not as deep in the comics scene as i would like to be. (money, time and stuff). So here we go:

First: As far as i understood it, a lot of writers would've been really thankful to get the possibility to write hellblazer, why didn't they try out big names for the nu52-stantine and as a selling point said something along the lines of: Just pretend it's hellblazer, we might occasionally do a crossover but you will have artistic freedom at most time. They don't seem to have a problem with graphical content (the first appearance of midnite comes to mind), john smoking or swearing. I mean the didn't seem to care about the 'little' points, how in the world did they screw up the important ones.

Second: If Milligans run was declining in sales (and it must have), why did he get to do it for so long. I mean 50 freakin issues (longest run). They kind of scared away ellis cause they didn't publish shoot. Couldn't they have done something alike with milligan?

Third: Whats up with vertigo anyway? There was a time (i'm still kind of catching up) when vertigo seems to have been THE place to go for high quality, good stories and artistic freedom. What happened? I looked into american vampire, but i was just like 'okay'.

Fourth: I really really loved the art in hellblazer when it seemed to have been drawn by hand (with real ink) and the coloring was done with real brushes. The later art (somewhere along issue twohundred-something) in hellblazer seemed to have been done on computer and looked more sterile (i hope you get my meaning, i'm not a native english speaker). It lost that lsd-trippy kind of way the hellblazer comics had and a lot of the horrofeeling too. Why the change?

Edited by seventhcircle
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A. Heathen    1,162

I would say they knew Hellblazer was ending and either didn't want to sign someone up, or no-one wanted to take it on.

 

They *could* have got a bunch of excellent writers to do a story each building up to the end, but that would require work on the part of the editors. Who have collectively been prone to letting Hellblazer down for a long time.

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A. Heathen    1,162

Oh, I seem to recall that Bisleys art is un-inked pencils, which is why it looks more organic than whatever you call the guy who drew Milligan's "Hellblazer The Changing Man and his Jail Bait Bird"

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Christian    783

I think certain editors were so hell-bent on gettin JC back to DC that they didn,t care about HB. The ratings were liw, and editorial wanted the book gone, so they probably figured they'd just let Milligan kill it off.

As far as the New 52, you have to conclude the people in charge are simply incompetent. They have the #1 best-seller most months with Batman, and they seem happy simply with that victory.

It's obvious they think big cross-overs are the way to bring in sales, like it's 1991...when it's more likely to kill reader interest in 2014, especially with horrible writing.

That's probably why Constantine is ailing to get people interested in working on it. They realize they have little creative control, and that DC is going to force months long cross-overs on the book.

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Demon Chas08    295

I think certain editors were so hell-bent on gettin JC back to DC that they didn,t care about HB. The ratings were liw, and editorial wanted the book gone, so they probably figured they'd just let Milligan kill it off.

As far as the New 52, you have to conclude the people in charge are simply incompetent. They have the #1 best-seller most months with Batman, and they seem happy simply with that victory.

It's obvious they think big cross-overs are the way to bring in sales, like it's 1991...when it's more likely to kill reader interest in 2014, especially with horrible writing.

That's probably why Constantine is ailing to get people interested in working on it. They realize they have little creative control, and that DC is going to force months long cross-overs on the book.

 

 

Thus why I really can't see the title surviving long regardless of the TV show and Fawkes isn't going nowhere until the book gets canned

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seventhcircle    595

But... I mean they must see it does not work, don't they? How can there not have been a single mind in dc that is telling somebody in charge what is wrong. Don't they get like feedback from 'fan'-mail? *grml I mean there are articles like http://www.newsarama.com/18869-the-new-52-two-years-later-the-worst-of-the-dc-reboot.html or http://whatculture.com/comics/5-things-wrong-with-dcs-new-52-comics-reboot.php or http://themodern-nerd.com/the-new-52-has-failed-by-jesse-berberich/

So why is nothing happening?

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