Avaunt

Jason, are you guys still run out of things in the supermarket?. Crikey !.

We have almost fully stocked shelves in our local one. I have been ONCE in four weeks, because when I moved here to help look after mum, I kept a list of what was used for two weeks, and that was just after Xmas. Then I got my niece to take me to the supermarket, and brought just under 2000 bucks worth of staples like flour, T.P. oil, pasta, rice, tinned fruit, cereal, UHT milk boxes, BEERS ! etc. This was weeks before the first death here, maybe three weeks? can't remember really.

And I got about five Kgs of the particular apple I like because they were on special, five pumpkins, ten Kgs of tomatoes, and put them into preserving jars My mum has three cupboards of preserving jars, something like 50 jars I think, from 25 years ago when she used to do that sort of thing. I just wish I had brought twice the lids I needed for one batch, as at the moment there are heaps of different kinds of fruit at the supermarket going quite reasonably cheap, and we have emptied half the bottles, but I don't have any more lids.

The pumpkin preserved like that is SUPER cool, because it is par-cooked, it makes it hell easy to roast or if you want them boiled you hardly have to do more than bring some of it to the boil and serve. There have been pumpkins up until recently in the supermarket, but this has meant that the wummuns  have not had to risk going shopping for as much stuff. My sister did much the same thing, but she used the freezer as well. I just find preserving makes it last better, longer.

As my brothers were fond of saying to me, I would make someone a grand wife one day !.

On 4/17/2020 at 4:03 AM, Lou K said:

We had a protest at the MI capitol last night. Pretty sure that does not follow social distancing. But I do not entirely agree with the severity of the Governor's orders. SHe mandates no paint supplies to be bought, no gardening supplies, etc. That is a bit much. If you want people to stay at home then give them things to do.

I have to agree with this. If we can be trusted to obey distancing and washing hands well enough to be there buying dish-washing soap and cheese, how is it different to add a bit of paint?

And in fact they could EASILY have an ordering system, for things like that, and you could walk up to a counter and show your receipt and the staff could push the boxed stuff to you with a stick, and it would be perfectly controllable.

A local Sargent of police here went on the book of faces and told the people in his area ( town of less than 25 000 with exactly fuck-all of fuck-all shops in the joint anyway ) that he might be going to have constables wander around the supermarket looking in peoples shopping trolleys, to see they were not buying light-bulbs and three packs of no-brand socks, as that wasn't essential.

Of course the Police Commissioner and the Prime Minister both said "Hold up ! ! !" and made it clear that nothing of the sort was going to take place. I read that similar things happened in the UK and the USA.

In a light hearted matter, our Deputy Prime Minister, my mate Winston, put up a post of him standing on the edge of his back yard, fishing in the estuary that runs right along his boundary.

All the Kiwi fishers that are forbidden to  even carry their rods to the closest beach went

I have actually fished just up the estuary but the opposite shore from his place, caught a fish with every cast, until I got sick of pulling them in. Snapper, dog-fish, Kahawai, two school sharks, and a stingray.

On 4/17/2020 at 4:03 AM, Lou K said:

 

Have they restricted traffic through their area? as I understand it, they have quite a bit of autonomy in their local by-laws?. Maybe lots of people nearby are using their area as "freedom" from the lockdown restrictions?.

People are organising mass protests in certain US states, deliberately meeting in groups to protest the lockdown continuing.

I wish I wasn't so sure you guys are going to be right. Even the people who don't like the guy, a considerable percentage are going to feel unwilling to rock the boat, it is just human nature to prefer the status quo.

It isn't as if people can hope he does something stupid that many people can't stomach, is it. That would be some really outrageous thing, given all the previous things he has done and got away with.

My nephew had to go to the supermarket. A young guy was walking around with a i-pod on a speaker phone, quietly playing the music from Plague incorporated.  Nick said that the older people were looking suspicious about the younger ones laughing.

New Zealand is maybe taking this less than perfectly seriously, because we have got it under control much easier than other countries have, only one death, and maybe 1200 confirmed cases. We have been very lucky, but also extremely well directed by our Government. Thank goodness it was a Labour government in charge, our right wing vermin would certainly have hesitated to go so full-on about it, and we would have not been so lucky. And they would have done the bare minimum they could to help the needy, and rewarded the wealthy, that is their  "thing" after all.

The direct example of what would have happened to us, is what is happening in NSW in Australia. The worst possibly combination of a  Nationalist federal government of Australia, and extremely toxic coalition of the farmers party and the nationalist right wing party as the State government of NSW. Consequently they have completely dropped the ball on dealing with the actual events, because they have been so focused on helping businessmen, farmers, landlords and shareholders. And deliberately let the infected people off half a dozen cruise ships because they didn't want to disrupt the tourist contribution to the local economy.

Now that has gone so bad, they are conducting a mock trial of the cruise-line companies, to divert public opprobrium for the moment. The cruise company TOLD the health authorities they were turning back with sick people they suspected of having the virus. And were told to let the passengers go ashore.  The state government is quite aware that the "manslaughter trial" is going to find that the error was their own, but they are going to go through the motions, because they can take a year to bring the case to trial after all.

I was wondering about that, Christian. It is a common occurrence through history, something traumatic is followed by a baby boom 9 months later. It will give some of us something to do for the next few years when our previous casual International travel becomes a thing of the past.

Wow. I hope you guys dodge the worst symptoms Ade. Most people do it seems.

I have been isolated since about the last day of February myself because I am looking after my mum as the main care-giver, my sister and niece have been coming once a day to bath her.

The sisters job is virtually isolation anyway, but my niece is a bit concerning as she is the representative of a major radar and sonar maker here in NZ, so she was flying all around the country twice a day during the initial stages of of it being here. Even if she was as careful as she insists ( which I doubt, she is one of the more careless and "She'll be right mate" people I know,) there isn't a lot you can do about things sitting in a plane with people.

We should be right, it seems like we have broken the community transmission here, but don't want to jink it.

Mum lives right next to Auckland's second biggest volcano, which has a park on it like 90% of them do, and it is AMAZING to see how many people are going for their exercise on it every day, from dawn to well into the dusk. And the street, which is  out of the way as these things go, is pretty constantly flocking people.

The thing is, if you are ALL bankrupt, you can just blink and say "no one is bankrupt" and  everyone will say

"Go on . . ." and agree with some compromise.

The other option, of packing up our toys and stopping living, isn't an option, is it.

Glad to hear from The Pooka !.  I wish I could watch the little Timelady cracking jokes, and running mummy around the twist.

Christian, you are quite right about half measures being the worst possible response. I dread to think what the actual toll is going to be in the USA, because BUSINESS as usual is going to be the order of the day if tRump can help it, and we know how well business takes care of the vulnerable, don't we.

What I  worry about is to working poor people, the undocumented, and their children. Even if this stopped in three weeks time, it is going to have destroyed their precarious hold on the means to keep their heads afloat. How can people endure losing a months income, when in previous years they have always barely scraped by?.

And what systematic and effective help is the US way of doing things capable of offering them?.

My nephew lives on a farm at the outskirts of Christchurch, South Island. Their house is in view of some of the foothills of the Southern Alps. He said the air has been noticeably cleaner the last two days.

I worry that you are being too sanguine about Americas risk. Your commercial/capitalist forces are going to deny you a proper response to this. You guys won't test most of the poor, who are always the hot-bed of any epidemic, and your business interests/President are almost certain to force you all back to work before the sensible time.

How are all the homeless and undocumented going to survive without work/shelter/food for a month, for one thing.

EVERYONE in New Zealand is being given financial support while the lock down takes place. I already got the first weeks 485 dollars, which is about 3/4 of my in the hand weekly wage so if I wanted to, I could argue them up to 80%. Maybe I should, but actually I am feeling very Socialist, I don't need it, so I won't gripe.

My nephew got a lump sum of seven thousand, *plop* in his account, because he filled in a form with receipts explaining about expenditure he made for materials, for a roofing-job he was going to do, and now can't. Took four days for them to OK it and give him the money . . . "Who are you people, and what have you done with New Zealands Bureaucracy ?". . .

After the money was in his account, someone from the Tax department rang up, with a script to read through to him, which basically was saying "If you are genuine about this, the Government will be very understanding. However . . . we have a vast number of people working from home at the moment, and we are going to be looking for some scapegoats to prosecute". When/if he gets paid by the roof-owner, he has to pay the government back the money they gave him. I asked him if, in the case the job doesn't get done now, who owns the materials, but the paperwork doesn't say anything about that.

I think every economy in the world is going to tank. How can it not?. So Brexit is going to be something like a firecracker let off in an artillery barrage.

My sister was a home schooler for her two children Lou. She just told me to tell you, from the start, reward the "I'm bored, there is nothing to do" noise with a chore like learning how to empty the dishwasher, or sweep the floor.

I am not giving "how to keep wife on-side" advice, me being unable to draw on personal knowledge and you being at least  some years experienced.

Auckland sounds so quiet ! It is spooky, like some sort of movie special effect. Just the occasional bird noise, and sometimes people talking.

That can only be the cat bouncing though, because every economy in the world is going to retract by 30 to 50%. You only have to look at how large a part of every nations GDP was bound up in tourism.

Just the decrease in insurance policies is going to know 2% off New Zealands economy.

How did the players deal with it? Running away?.

Haven't heard from Pooka for a while, have we?.

Hello Brother. :)  Stay well, ok?

Max is five, so he is past the really difficult age, imagine if this was happening and he was three still :)

My nephews and nieces are all well here, the two youngest, my twins youngest boy and girl, are living in a city so far away, I have not seen them for months. Won't see them now for at least four weeks, probably much longer.

I am sorry if you thought I meant you personally expected people to get a free house, Christian, I really didn't. The thing about our two Nations is we share a language that divides us ( not my thought of course ) and when I say something to you, or vice versa, we hear it in a local accent. For example, when you say that about the police kicking someone out of their house "for" the bank. I have seen the Sheriff Department doing enforcement's in the US, on TV, so I know what you mean, but that literally can't happen here. The Police listen to the bank, and say "This is a civil matter, take it to trial"  and would and do point blank refuse to get involved. 

Now, you may say that amounts to the same thing, but it really doesn't. Each case is judged on its merits, before a judge. What this means is, the banks are strictly above suspicion in foreclosures. They follow the very letter of the law, and when people ARE silly enough to fight even though they have had a fair shake of the stick, they have to convince a lawyer to represent the case to a judge. Again, this makes the thing above suspicion, because any lawyer would LOVE to take a winning case, it happens on occasion in fact. A case in point is a woman recently got relief because the bank was found to have knowingly put her in a debt position she could not service, because of her health and age. They did it because they thought her son was good for the principle, in effect, but didn't tie him into the loan. The judge criticised both parties, but accepted that the bank, professional money loaners, was the primary cause. She didn't get the house, but she did get compensation once the property was sold. Her legal fees in that case were entirely paid for by the bank, because the judge pointed out the legal fees had been caused by the bank !.

As I understand the US model, they will loan money to anyone, and are not restricted in anyway with the terms they offer. Here, there are minimum deposits, and maximum interests chargeable, and if the loaner runs into trouble they are allowed to require the bank help them by halting the interest while the sale of the asset takes place, and quite a few other things.

, New Zealand just went onto restricted movement with all public gatherings forbidden, shops except the usual essential ones closed, and in 48 hours it is going to be virtual house quarantine  for everyone.

I instantly walked down to the Grog shop and brought the last bottle of spirits I will see for a while, will use a TEENY WEENY shot glass. So very glad I have been saving money like mad for the last three years. I am going to break out my crafting tools, though I can't use the power tools much I expect, because it would disturb mum. Might try some lost-wax castings.

Every house in the street just vomited a car headed to the supermarket, even though the Prime Minister just told people not to do that.

Good points about the oil.

Are we ever going back to the "international jet-holidays are cheap because we are just ignoring the long term costs on the environment" days of last month ? If not, there are going to be a couple of hundred thousand people here in NZ who need re-training . . . in some newly invented long-term employment . . . which certainly defeats my imagination, I can't think of what might be done. Ocean going Sail-liners?. Cutty-Sarks and people take their holidays every two years, and take a months sailing holiday?. That leaves Kiwiland right out of it, too far and 40% of the year the seas down here are EXPERTS ONLY.

I don't think they ( ? which they, the individuals that own a couple of rental homes? The corporations that own apartment blocks? The Insurance companies that ended up "owning" lots of homes when the companies that previously owned them went broke? there isn't a They in fact, that can sit somewhere and scheme ) COULD do something exploitative about the rents/housing at this point. How would they enforce it?. Our Police force would refuse to evict people at present. Our Police force has just announced they are going to stop running drink-driving suppression missions so as to avoid exposing their membership to chances of infection, they ain't gunna go evict a couple of hundred thousand families then, are they?.

And if they did try it at present, there would be chaos, very likely one of your Anarchist Wonderlands would spontaneously erupt, do you think?.

To be serious about it though, our Government has already instructed the banks to make allowance for mortgage holidays. If they didn't do it, they would be regulated till they squeaked. They are not going to evict people. They are also not going to forget the debts, nor should they. Every house represents someones property, someones asset, after all. I would be sore if someone was renting my property and then said "Times are tough, so I own it now and you don't".

Yes, I meant specifically the Northern towns that have taken control of events at a local level. There was a news item here making  the comparison between the different responses different cities there have taken. Also had a piece on it about idiot students going to Florida for drinking holidays . . . some people need leading around by the hand.

I totally agree that they shouldn't bail out the airlines. Our government is doing it here too, Air New Zealand. It is irrational, obviously there is going to be no air-travel for at least 6 months.

They should just tell them "Mothball the things, ain't no point doing anything else, ain't now-where to fly to !".

A lot of Kiwis are stupid when it comes to Air New Zealand, probably simply because it has the countries name on it. People constantly repeat the phrase "Figurehead Company ! ! ! " as if that is some self-evident truth, when actually it is just a for profit corporation, if tomorrow it made business sense to move to Hong Kong, they would be gone in an instant.

Yeah, that Trump will literally spin anything, with any lie, no matter how blatant . . . the guy is monstrous, really ugly, as malignant a politician as I have ever seen. And he talks just like a school-boy bully so often . . . makes me shrug my shoulders.

The Government isn't shutting down the economy though. Still a lot of money to be made selling toilet paper, sanitiser, body bags, shovels, etc.

"Well, it's _rather_ brutal here. We are advising OUR clients to put everything they've got  into Canned Food and Shotguns"

Netflix is choking your resolution down in Europe ! ! !  Pitchforks and torches, and out into a ( dispersed at two meter intervals ) angry mob !.

I have moved into my mums house to be primary care-giver, because she is on the decline, 88 years old, heart failure, etc. I am off work anyway still with my ribs, so I am looking after her and the females come in once a day to give her a bath. Mum has had three doses of pneumonia already this year, because of the heart failure mostly, and its concomitant weakness, she can't breath deeply enough to keep her lungs working properly. I have not left the house for three weeks except for two trips, masked and gloved, to the supermarket, so in a way I am self-isolating anyway.

There isn't really a large number of cases of the virus here yet, but I did the mask thing hoping to reduce my chance of getting the NORMAL flu, which would probably kill mum in days.

We brought a lot of stuff she or I will need here, piles of things that will keep, weeks ago, not to horde and get it first, but to reduce the times I have to leave the house and might carry an infection back into it. Also getting the supermarket to deliver, but that might be stopped it seems.

No one knows how long this is going to  effect us, but that said, I am personally slightly upbeat. We live on a series of Islands _spread out narrow over two thousand Kms,  with farmland between the cities, luckily_ with one government and no real social divisions like other countries have. We are all fairly educated and less superstitious than other Nations ( Bangladesh had a 30 000 person "pray against the virus" meeting where people stood side by side and that will never happen here. ) We have a cohesive Social Health System and an uncorrupt police and judiciary.  I actually think New Zealand is likely to deal with this quite successfully. China and Italy have given proof that if you mean business, you can seriously reduce transmission. Italy has not had many new cases in the Northern cities, since they got serious. Hubei seems to have halted it in its tracks, no new cases for two days.

Best of luck, to you all.

I am still alive. Though I did end up with a broken rib, and four weeks off work. Am on first name basis now with my Accident Compensation Commission agent.

People here in the ANZAC lands have gone mental and are binge-buying, so some of the shops have run out of toilet-paper. Idiots are offering to buy nine-packs of it on Trade-me, for multiple times its rrp

As the Elder, I thought I would stop by and share a secret.  If you get newspaper, and scrunch it up in a ball for  maybe 2 minutes medium hard scrunching, it turns into perfectly utile toilet paper. It does make ones ringpiece a bit black, but the ink washes off.

Those of you with urchins, can resurrect an ancient, almost lost tradition. Sit them in  a comfortable chair, and give them a newspaper. Offer some cheap reward such as gummy-bears, or the new internet code, for a whole  perfectly scrunched up newspaper.

Wow. Thieves world. I read them all as they came out, but could not for the life of me tell you the plot, or weft or warp or EVEN the colour of any of the strings, of any of them.

The only things I remember from them, is one little bit of cunning magic economy ( Instead of summoning an entire high level demon, a mage had tailored his spell to summon just the Brobdingnagian limb and paw  of one, with the codicil that our realm was uncomfortable for the critter, and it couldn't leave till it took a life. ) and one of the characters mentioning that he was a thief and sometime murderer, not a rapist, as if there are levels of acceptable in the trades.

So, not as memorable as Anderson, in my eyes.