Claire

Um...hello?

Just finished Macroscope by Piers Anthony. Over all I was pleasently suprised. I found it a bit too episodic and rambling for the first two thirds, but I liked the ideas and I'm a sucker for books with diagrams.

About to start Valis. I think it's one I managed to miss in my Philip K. Dick binge of 2002.

(That sentence is object lesson in why you don't ever want to refer to Philip K. by last name only.)

Sorry to derail the thread from comic actors, but...

The only other one in the list above that is even close to my experience is the one about gay men. In my experence, many to most straight women don't want to hear a guy they might be even mildly considering say anything too positive about gay stuff.

 

On the other hand, I've had women become more positive toward me when I mentioned gay things, or did or said something that would suggest that I was gay. But these women are invariably bisexual and/or lesbian identified. And no, that did not stop anything from happening. 8-)

...I think you missed my point there, Josh. By "complains about 'gay men always after my arse' " I meant blokey straight men making homophobic comments ie "I can't come to town without some fucking faggot trying to pick me up".

Which tells me stright away that he's deeply fucked up about sexuality and masculinity. I mean it's obvious that guys like this get some kind of kick out thinking that gay men are lusting after them, otherwise why bring it up all the time? But point that out to them and all you get is confusion, hostility, homophobic ranting and, finally, mysoginistic abuse.

Are there any particular early issues you'd be willing to swap for it?

Basically anything pre #20 or anything #30-#40. I'll double check and get back to you.

But, you might or might not (I don't know) be surprised at how many men and women completely do not understand the differences between the way males and females interact.

That book Men are from Mars, Women are from Venus, universally reviled around here, is actually an incredible boon to so many people in failing relationships and marriages.

How old are these people? Do they tend to be in a certain age bracket or are they all ages?

I ask because I grew up (in the trying to be genuinely bi-cultural NZ of the 80's and early 90's) with the idea that people had all sorts of different ways of communicating based on culture, upbringing, age, peer group etc. Therefore one had to approach anyone with this in mind and be willing to alter one's own communication style to fit.

I know from my dad that he grew up thinking his style of thought and communication was the universal norm, and he had no end of grief with women because of that. So I can certainly understand how MAFM,WAFV is a help to people of his generation. Especially as their conditioning in appropriate gender behaviour was so much stronger, creating wider difference between the sexes.

But I think that for younger people raised in a more pluralistic the society the idea of expecting people to act a certain way solely based on their sex is seen as a barier to communication.

Of course, in this discussion, we all have to remember that women occupy the full range of religious, political, ethical and personal points of view. Isn't it probable that in some of these cases you simply said something that went against the grain of her world view, and rather than confront you with it (as another man might be likely to do) she's just wanted to quietly drop the conversation?

In fact isn't that the problem? Not that women have some inhumanly cruel, mysterious rating system used to torment hapless males, but that women are less likely to voice disagreement or dislike to someone they've just met?

Maybe the best thing to do is ask straight up if you've said something that annoyed her or that she disgreed with. In my experience thats how these situations reslove themselves among women.

woman please be as abstract as possible and describe for me in vivid detail all five minutes when you turn from him entering your eyesight at the local tavern and him being relagated to the delete box.

Where did this idea originate?

I think it originated the first time a man who was enjoying a conversation with a woman did or said one wrong thing (though he might never know what that was) and suddenly the fun and vivacity dropped out of the woman's face and manner, clearly even if subtly, and the conversation was DOA, despite words still passing back and forth. And this occurring even when the man had no designs on the woman.

Well I can only respond from own experience, but the only times I, or one of my friends, has freezed out a guy like this have been because he

-made a rascist joke

-started complaining about 'gay men always after his arse'

-bad mouthed an ex girlfriend

-started up with negative comments about all other women in the vicinity

-kept hitting on me after I told him I was in a happy relationship

-was obviously too drunk to maintain a coherant conversation

-said that judging by my clothes I was looking for a fuck

-began droning on and on about a pet subject of his, oblivious to the listener's boredom

I think those are all fairly obvious conversational no-nos, myself.

I also agree with Christian that women tend to be more paranoid about hidden meanings. And, I cannot stress this enough, we're taught from an early age that all strange men are rapists. When it comes to conversation with a strange man in an anonymous social setting, it's fair to say alot of women are waiting for the creep alarm to go off.

This unworthy one is still looking for the ultra-rare issue 12. Has anyone even seen a copy? Don't make me download it! :)

If you're desperate to just read it, I could lend you my copy. I'm not nice enough to let you keep it though, unless you have any spare early issues you could swap for it.

I think it's expected that males are more aroused visually than women and therefore that a lot of them would choose the big breasted bimbo bitch.

Yeah, I think that's where the failure to communicate on this issue is. The point is many women get an ego boost from managing to attract a confident, flashy, sucessful etc man. I think this the same as the ego boost many men get from managing to attract a hot woman. In both cases the ego boost can blind people to their prospective partner's bad qualities.

It seems to me that the confused fellows on this board can easily make sense of a man going out with a mean but attractive woman, and yet expect women to be all high minded and never shallow in their chioce of boyfriends.

The idea that women invariably choose 'jerks' over 'nice guys' is a perenial favourite here. But has anyone ever brought up the equivalent? Why do so many men choose insecure, demanding, high maintenance bitches? For every nice guy who finshes last I bet there's a Scotty running after Madeliene and ignoring Midge.

Through out my life I've had many male friends, most of them geeky types like me. And they always seem to date women who share none of their interests, who actively belittle them for liking comics or sci or video games, and who expect to take up all of their time, money, and attention. I've had I guy I was friends with since high school tell me he was not 'allowed' to hang out with me anymore.

I'm sure some of you guys have had friends date girls/women like this.

Then when it enevitably turns to shit, what justification do they give for dating the girl in the first place? Well, she was hot, of course!

The fact of the matter is women can be just as shallow as men. And thats probably why (some) women (some of the time) choose jerks. Because the jerk was hot. Or because he made her feel special and sexy. Or because it seemed like being with him would exciting. Whatever, it all comes down to this- the idea of being with him was enough of a turn on that she was able to temporarily ignore/put up with his asshattery.

The truth is that all human beings are guilty of weaving exotic (and unrealistic) fantasies of who we want to be with. We're all, to an extent, attracted to the unknown, exciting and unpredictable rather than someone we can actually relate to. Sadly, we tend to want the lover and the relationship that will impress other people, rather than the one we can be happy in.

woman please be as abstract as possible and describe for me in vivid detail all five minutes when you turn from him entering your eyesight at the local tavern and him being relagated to the delete box.

Where did this idea originate? I could maybe tell after five minutes of conversation which men and women I wouldn't want to sleep with. However anyone I choose to have as friend I find attractive on some level. Otherwise I wouldn't want to spend time with them. I'm offen suprised by glimpses of 'secret sexiness', even in people I've known for years and have never thought of that way before.

Ben, it sounds to me like she's trying to gauge your interest.

You have to let her know you're interested, but it doesn't have to be a big soul baring confession. Just tell her that you would like to be her boyfriend. Or if that's really too hard a 'secret' admirer note. Anything thats cute and kind of light hearted should work well with your personality.

I think you already know that the longer you put it off, the more likely it is to come out in a desparate and kind of scarey way.

(BTW when she was telling about hot guys I suspect the you're best response would have been "Well is he hotter than me?".)

Aww, he's gorgeous!

Just think, the world is now blessed with Battling K Bros: The Next Generation.

 

Tetsuo

Hedwig and the Angry Inch

 

I mean, that's just cool. I should have added both movies to my list and gone with 14.

 

Claire, have you seen Tetsuo II? If not, you're going to be getting a present in the mail, soon. I owe you for the comic books, anyway.

No, I've never seen Tetsuo II. Isn't it pretty much the same plot but longer and with skinhead body builders?

I wish that dude would make some more films instead of just acting in Miike's movies.

Gah! Rogan, quit undermining my attempts to do good!

Wolvy's spelling and grammar have improved, give him credit for that. As for the rest...well, one step at a time.

Wolvy has been polite and non-defensive to me when I suggested in PMs that he improve his spelling. It appears he's super senistive to percieved public attack.

So Rogan, do you want to try and solve a problem or do you just want the fun of riling against it?

This is a brilliant idea Ade. I almost never comment on the new issues as I get so much later that everthing I want to say already been posted. This way I might get a turn to not be the rundadent one.

Since when did spelling and grammar equal intelligence? Because I know for a fact that everybody can pretty much comprehend whatever is being written. The human brain has been proven to do so. no mattur whut is beeng wreitin. It's like everbody on the net has to have a panic attack because Loeb235vs spelled a word wrong or didnt use a coma or put a period at the end of their sentence.

I've stayed well clear of this whole thing, and this is the only time I'll comment.

Wolvy just let it go. Is anyone still hassling you about your writing? I'd be suprised if they are as you now write as well as most anyone on this board.

I'll admit that your posting style used to really bug me- remember that PM I sent the first time you posted here? And it was never because I thought you were unintelligent, it was because I thought you were capable of expressing yourself better. Turns out you are.

I don't know if you're just taking more care typing, or if you've actually been learning new grammar and spelling. The point is you seem to have steadily and naturally adopted a clearer syntax, without losing your unique 'voice'. If certain board members choose to mock (affectionately or otherwise) newer posters' spelling and grammer irregularities, you shouldn't take it as a personal attack. These days you have no reason to feel insecure about your writing.

(BTW I'm so glad you started using 'since' instead of 'sense'.)

Where are you?

Wellington, New Zealand

What were you doing before signing onto the internet today?

Learning how to be an assistant librarian.

What is your special talent/party piece?

Sitting cross-legged on top of the stove in the kitchen reading Alan Ginsgerg's Howl in it's entirety, then losing my voice.

If you were an animal, what would you be and why?

A Bower Bird as I can't stop collecting blue plastic junk.

Which member of the Straight to Hell forum would you most like to be dumped on an island with?

ACXchan. She's at least a dozen people.

Sing us a song.

Sorry I'm sober at the moment.

I haven't been hit on by a straight man in years.

I've gotten too adept at heading off potential interest and diverting it on to the safe path of friendship.

(Because I'm in a long term relationship, by the way, not because of any 'issues'.)

Dogs dressed like bees!

Possibly a sister site?

Stuff on my cat.

It's mostly shit Claire (pun intended), there are a few stand out moments, as I'm sure Spidey will agree Sarah Silverman's telling of the joke is bloody hilarious.

 

I'm convinced it's all a con though and this joke isn't one that has been doing the rounds backstage at comedy clubs for decades.

A tempting hypothesis. Someone with access to a good academic library needs to track down the 1975 book (Gershon Legman Rationale of the Dirty Joke Vol II) it's supposedly referenced in.

I was more interested in audience reaction than the actual film. I did love the Silverman clip though, and as I suspect we have similar tastes I expect your assessment is right.

Is the Monty Python quoter more or less anoying that the Douglas Adams bore? I'd start a poll but I'm having trouble figuring out how.

I was hoping The Aristocrats would be in this year's film festival. I was interested in watching it with an audience. Don't know if I can be bothered downloading it to watch by myself.

Didn't smoke anything crazy but I did drink whole bottles of cough syrup to try and get high off the DXM.

I tried that once. In the States it's known as "Robo-tripping."

All I got was an intense stomachache.

Mostly I just got drunk and numb. But once a friend and I split a bottle and both ended up having hallucinations of these

I'm sure you can explain it nicely. Maybe suggest something else for them to do. Explain that you won't think it's rude if they put some head phones on and listen to music for the drive.