A. Heathen

It depends what mood I am in.

A List

Dracula - as played by Christopher Lee even in the shit ones. Lugosi or Shreck on standby. Kinski (yes it really IS Dracula) in second place.

Frankenstein - you know, I like the conceit that, as Victor Frankenstein's creation he is entitled to the name Frankenstein. Pretty much any version from Karloff via De Niro to "Young Frankenstein". It's the pathos, you understand, qv Iron Giant and Blade Runner.

Werewolf/Hyde anything hinting at man's inner demons.

Predator - not an alien at all, but man's id civilised and given ace toys. The ultimate answer to the hard man action adventure hero.

Aliens. Yes. Watching Resurrection now and it is truly gorgeous. All of the films are in a genre of their own, and even the flawed computer game of the latest one has it's charm - should have stayed closer to Claremont's comic.

Sadako. Actually many of her contemporary ghosts are scarier in a more sustained fashion (all three Ju-Ons and Dark Water are more believable) but Sadako is fucking scary if you turn your oh-so-cool "I am not going to be impressed. Trouble is, the explanation rips out the horror ... so Ju On wins.

Leatherface. Brutal. Pointless. Nasty. And his little kids turned up in 1000 Corpses and Devils Rejects.

Candyman. If it's a myth, how can you believe it's not true ? And in any case, it may just be Helen's insanity in which case more believable than all the above. Bernard Rose's Paperhouse is one of the scariest films ever and Candyman has Tony Todd !

Godzilla KICKS KONG'S HAIRY APE ASS.

Some of the reactions seem a little too much like the usual conservative comic fans cries of "it's doesn't look like what's gone on before!"

 

If by "what's gone on before," you mean "good," then yes, I'd agree.

 

There's not a lot of stylistic commonalities flowing from any of the past HB cover artists to the next, other than that they were all highly talented individuals with great vision. McKean is very different from Fabry who is wildly different than Philips who is yet even more different from Bradstreet, but they all had great vision. So, I really don't think the complaint has anything to do with how the book looks style-wise. Talent-wise? That's another story.

Cheers Wolfram.

I see very few criticisms of "it's not like what's gone before".

Perhaps a few "it's not as good as".

And it really is just disappointment.

I can cite half a dozen contemporary artists who would have done a decent job on this sort of thing. Mind you, I could deal with Greg Kinner The Celebrity getting interested in Hellblazer and being Constanteen in the next film that Warners decide to extricate from the mewling corpse of a franchise.

Concept good, Realisation poor.

And since we are cross-posting from The V:

Glenn Fabry could have drawn that cover in 24 minutes.

Sean Phillips in half that time.

(But I'd have preferred Fabry's)

I think the covers are meant to be tattooed on Constanteen's arse.

OI!

Some of you monkeys owe Tim money !

Pay me now, or I start selling your art once they arrive.

Take a leaf from Greg Lauren's book and copy someone better than you.

This one ...

Jamie's back at Titan after a brief flirtation with Rebellion.

He's at least somehow involved in those nice reprints of The Spider and Steel Claw.

And if Diamond UK say comics are late because of a late delivery that'll be Diamond US who are responsible.

Let's see now. Here's a sample of reviews from some of the more regular posters on this board...

Shit, I'm the only one who realises how ordinary the film is !

Well, me and Keanu.

Cheers then.

Pop back and let us know how things are going.

No. You're right. I won't waste my time illustrating how - despite the similarities - there's a whole range of opinion here about the quality of the film.

And do you know what? I needn't even have bothered looking elsewhere for evidence, because on the two pages of this thread before JamesB shoved us all into the Hivemind category, five people expressed their own opinion, one was GenGris who said that James summed up the general feeling and then proceeded to disagree with some of his points ("I like it") and another was Hagren who loves the film like a long lost brother. Josh used the "we" word later.

And yet, JB, you seem to focus importance on this alleged seeking of other people's opinions to validate our own. I put it to you that in fact you are seeking to validate your own as special by lumping all the other points in as one.

Despite the opinions, of how the movie is rated, its always tied to the fact that dissapointment seems to permiate through, basd on the poor adapation.

Everyones opinion is valid, I think, and I am not sorry if I think that someone invoking a 'group' opinion, is not actually making a fair argument, and I supposse I would veer towards discounting that as part of an argument or point in a discussion.

Well. Why did you invoke the group opinion ?

Or at least why did you leap on that small aspect of what one poster said ?

So you could veer towards discounting it ?

Please feel free to argue some of the points made against the film rather than "it made money" or what amounts to "you're all ganging up against me because I have special comprehension skills".

Because it is not your fondness for the film that is starting get annoying (ask the three of "us" who have been positive about the film in this thread) it is your attempt to ignore the facts that most of the reviews of the film were positive where they could be. Even Tom's.

Hey look, Hagren does that even in a second language (although missing a fair bit of irony in the translation).

In which The Tate Club gets a speech to remember, Cheryl gets flowers, Lucifer (the comic book) gets a nod, Constantine tells us what God's plan really is.

And then walks away from his ghosts.

Oh, and "You people need to fucking well get over yourselves".

Really have gone to Hell in an arsebiscuit.

http://dcboards.warnerbros.com/web/categor...jsp?cat=Vertigo

McMahon - send missionaries !

Bendis used to write the way that he would need to write Hellblazer - Jinx etc would be perfect - but he's not been there for ages - even in Daredevil - and I don't think I could face the wordballoonorrhoea.

After all, Elllis, another writer I eally enjoyed, essentially was censored by the all couragous DC for a story about a school yard shooting. Has anybody actually read Hard Time 50 to Life by steve gerber. The stench of hypocrital appeasement is rife from the managament of DC on that one.

Ellis did not want to make any changes so he pulled out.

Will Pfeifer's Finals was edited and went ahead.

There is no hypocrisy involved in subsequent publication of Hard Time because the story came out much later, and Vertigo's concern was that it was too soon for Finals/Shoot.

And US sales for Hellblazer have dropped around 15,000 (50%) in the ten years since issue 96, but less than 2,000 (net) since the end of Paul Jenkins run (with a plateau for Ellis / Azzarello of between 18,000 and 20,000).

It's hard to find a comparable title during that time, but Flash has gone from 56,000 to 50,000 since 1995, Wonder Woman from 73,000 to 38,000 and Bart Simpson's Treehouse of Horror from 33,000 to 13,000.

Look James(B) we've been going over this again and again for almost a year, so forgive us for not enumerating our different feelings about the film. Consider that there was a concerted effort by those involved (tenuously and directly) in the film to paint any comics fan who expressed dislike for the film as "not happy that he was not a blond englishman" etc.

Only one person connected with the film ever took the time to address the very diverse problems that we (collectively) had, and loads of fans of Keanu came here and were very nice as James(W) said without a trace fo sarcasm that you read into it. (See what happened there? You assumed the worst when the best was true.)

Now, if you are interested in seeing how the Hivemind works here, read these three simple threads for a picture of diversity.

Reasons for prejudice against the film.

http://hellblazer.ipbhost.com/index.php?showtopic=1113

Seen Constanteen? Feedback thread.

http://hellblazer.ipbhost.com/index.php?showtopic=981

What version of the DVD do you own?

http://hellblazer.ipbhost.com/index.php?showtopic=2238

The summary is that there are two major problems with the film, which some people hold both and others hold only the one.

A) it has not got enough of the source material, ie it's only about 6.66% Hellblazer.

B) it is not very good / it is not good enough / it is a pile of crap

See? Even part B has split opinion.

Even those of us who lean towards A and B have been positive about the positives, but other than James I, none of us are inclined to repeat ourselves again this long after the fact.

You veer towards discounting other people's opinions here because they happen to agree with the majority here. Strangely enough, no-one has tried to similarly devalue the opinion of anyone who (honestly) likes the movie. You correctly refer to the fact that we aren't very many even in the context of Hellblazer readers, so it should not be surprising that a small group of friends has shared opinions. Ask the Pro-Constanteeny people how they overcame the lack of love for That Awful Film. Hagren's already spoken up, and there's a bunch of Keanu fans around the internet who have find memories of their time here.

Anyway, don't let your welcome here be defined by this - we'll have forgotten the (lack of)bastard film in a year.

A couple of other points your raise - more people saw the film because much more was spent on advertising and because Keanu has a fan base. But most people spent less than £10 on one occasion for it, whereas we spend more than twice that every year.

As for your repeated proclamation ( and Mojo's question) about falling sales:

I've answered this in detail somewhere, and US comic shop sales for Hellblazer have dropped in line with the middle range of the direct market chart. At the same time the top twenty or so have soared ridiculously as the market congeals around its core readers. So a few non-superhero titles flourish, but others lose sales in favour of the sure-fire sales. Don't be fooled into thinking these titles sell because Bendis or Millar or whoever are "good". I'd rather Hellblazer takes chances with its writers.

There's been a 4000 (20%) drop in Hellblazer's US direct market sales since Mike Carey took over, but that period has coincided (at last) with the release of trade paperback collections - sadly they are still woefully behind schedule, something which could have been rectified before the film. Just under 4000 of these are bought by comics retailers in the first month of release - significantly more go to non direct market shops. That's a factor in all of the Vertigo titles being allowed lower cut off point - the major factor is that they want to publish something different to the mainstream.

As for the film boosting sales - no.

Latest numbers are about the same as this time last year, at least up until September when #200 saw an extra 1600 sold (plus 1300 the following month, which Hellblazer never does).

The release of the film in the US saw an extra 1000 copies going to the comic shops, and the publication of three "graphic novels" for the non-specialist market. One of those was a crap collection, all but ignored by the direct market. One was okay but really didn't address the missing issues. And the final one was "All His Engines" HARDCOVER which has outsold all recent Hellblazer TPBs (and one critic said it is "as good as Watchmen" or something). DC dropped the ball on the TPBs and by allowing Mike to write a great big long continuity arc at this time - WITHOUT publishing the collections at a rapid rate.

I voted for Tom to be the spokesperson for everyone about the film "Constanteen".

Despite the fact that I like Keanu films and enjoyed his performance in this awful film.

That's how democracy works.

I love the way the TARDIS lands this time :-)

No Hagren, the film makers called it Constanteen so we'd know that it's not about the same character.

It's in post #34, but you're not the only one who hasn't paid yet !

Just1page)at(aol)dot(com is the address to paypal me.

Um...in the interests of saving you (and us) the hassle of UK-to-Norway postage, is there any chance you could arrange to have the prints for Pål and I sent with the London-inhabiting friends of mine who are coming to visit me here just before New Year? If you PM me, I can call my mate and arrange some sort of hand-over. Or, failing that, just pass on your phone number/e-mail address to him, so you can sort it out for yourself.

 

Either way, payment is pending as soon as possible.

Good idea, Mr Mark-the-Hat.

And pooka? Yes, £19.

By the way, in the unlikely event of there being any money left over, I'll put it in the Just 1 Page pot.

What is this film that everyone's suddenly talking about?

Have I missed something?

I still say we need a "sticky" Film FAQ in this part of the forum with text composed by Professor Thomas Willecome.

I thought you was going to be my apprentice.

Okay folks, just got off the phone to "Impending Father Tim" who, like his almost namesake - Father Time - may well be busy at the New Year !

Here's the deal.

Tim is looking to start the printing process on Monday, so the absolute deadline for ordering is Monday evening my time. Anyone in the UK or Europe who wants to add to the order (see up thread) can do so. Slick gets in thanks to the kindness of Pooka. Unless he wants to make amends some other way ;-)

The cost of sending A3 prints for Just 1 Page was just under £2,

and I want to make sure you get sturdier envelopes so that's probably another £2.

Tim's investigating the cost of posting the prints to the UK and so I will add a rough approximation of the costs for that. To be on the safe side let's say £1 per print (not including the free one!). If costs end up much cheaper, I'll refund you accordingly.

And the FINAL ORDERS with postage costs added:

James $50 = £28.50 + £6

19/08: 213, 206, (215)

Sethos $20 = £11.50 + £5

19/08: 214

Lost Johnny $65 = £37 + £7

19/08: 213, 214, 202, (215)

Slickevil $90 = £51 + £9

19/08: 187, 189, 202, 210, 214, (215)

Red: $20 = £11.50 + £5

19/08: 214 "Signed would be nice. You can make it out to Red aka. Pål (That's P, then an A with a ring over it, and then L) "

Hmpf: $20 = £11.50 + £5

29/08: 214

Electricinca: $65 = £37 + £7

10/10: 202, 213, 214, (215)

Pooka: $25 = £14 + £5

20/10: 204

Kinki: $100 = £57 + £9

Proof requested: 162, 163, 175, 182, 184, (215).

Personalized? No.

Signed? yes please.

(she comes in late and is the ONLY PERSON TO FOLLOW INSTRUCTIONS !)

Mark: $50 = £28.50 + £6

25/10: 211, 213, (215)

Ade: $90 = £51 (ha! I don't have to pay myself !)

2x 213, 214, 2x 202, (215)

Right, new bugs, you have until Monday 12/12 6.66pm.

Paypal me now IN POUNDS STERLING if you can:

just1page@aol.com

enter BRADSTREET ROCKS in the title

That's my preferred method, but I may consider old-fashioned monetary means.

Good shot Kinki!